Received: (at 53452) by debbugs.gnu.org; 25 Jan 2022 12:45:28 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jan 25 07:45:27 2022 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47274 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1nCLCR-0003we-Ec for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 07:45:27 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:34454) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nCLCP-0003pF-HQ for 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 07:45:25 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=33456 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nCLCJ-0007vk-Qj; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 07:45:20 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=Eew4PTIqgNNLE7ibadW4AlU9TUEIUcKFDmcYiA1wYWU=; b=C/zUs0sCkUk1v3RzMUqC dVQoSpDHjmP0UV2P0UuCmPD7CdEZobByyISTavusqYCi2+OIuypuaKLg0y7CAa8xo+ajoYV0C+bRy 2VAc3CVIeMZfKWBnbiwoG/LAZvXVyx8wbdQDSkD1cqTSxTnbf3lfJlNSl6eN5Ze9sN4DOEujtBSQE XAjJQkyq0IeyIFaCi+H18DS4pD8XmQT5zrHr62D/8vcU2Kx56JotfJnyZva2PaeGn+xOs+PNYzbVE ECkeHC9hbPWqmmeZ25VrgYCQBl+9YoWgEiGIRRV5y5PwDhfVdMZcKStibXTiB+9LZ436Vw0Oq+Y/7 gXcLrtvez3j13A==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=2084 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nCLCJ-0002tE-9x; Tue, 25 Jan 2022 07:45:19 -0500 Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2022 14:45:09 +0200 Message-Id: <83h79shtm2.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <878rv4htza.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Robert Pluim on Tue, 25 Jan 2022 13:37:13 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#53452: 29.0.50; C-<arrow> selection broken by translate-upper-case-key-bindings References: <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5.ref@Ergus> <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5@Ergus> <834k5vmvf0.fsf@HIDDEN> <87czkhjtes.fsf@HIDDEN> <83wnipjohu.fsf@HIDDEN> <87pmohi818.fsf@HIDDEN> <83r18xjlrj.fsf@HIDDEN> <87czkgi0cq.fsf@HIDDEN> <83mtjkhubf.fsf@HIDDEN> <878rv4htza.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 53452 Cc: spacibba@HIDDEN, 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> > Cc: spacibba@HIDDEN, 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2022 13:37:13 +0100 > > >>>>> On Tue, 25 Jan 2022 14:29:56 +0200, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> said: > > >> From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> > >> So either we fix the behaviour, or the documentation. Would it be that > >> hard to restrict this to something like [a-z] or !function key? Or we > >> could always add yet-another-user-option. > > Eli> My point was that the behavior is probably okay, and the documentation > Eli> should be amended if it could confuse. > > Itʼs only ok if weʼre ok with shift-selection being broken by it. Are > we? Like I said: I don't see how shift-selection could NOT be broken by disabling shift-translation, because it DEPENDS on it.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#53452; Package emacs.
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From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#53452: 29.0.50; C-<arrow> selection broken by
translate-upper-case-key-bindings
References: <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5.ref@Ergus>
<20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5@Ergus> <834k5vmvf0.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87czkhjtes.fsf@HIDDEN> <83wnipjohu.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87pmohi818.fsf@HIDDEN> <83r18xjlrj.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87czkgi0cq.fsf@HIDDEN> <83mtjkhubf.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2022 13:37:13 +0100
In-Reply-To: <83mtjkhubf.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Tue, 25 Jan
2022 14:29:56 +0200")
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>>>>> On Tue, 25 Jan 2022 14:29:56 +0200, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> said:
>> From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
>> So either we fix the behaviour, or the documentation. Would it be th=
at
>> hard to restrict this to something like [a-z] or !function key? Or we
>> could always add yet-another-user-option.
Eli> My point was that the behavior is probably okay, and the documenta=
tion
Eli> should be amended if it could confuse.
It=CA=BCs only ok if we=CA=BCre ok with shift-selection being broken by it.=
Are
we?
Robert
--=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#53452; Package emacs.
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bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#53452; Package emacs.
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From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#53452: 29.0.50; C-<arrow> selection broken by
translate-upper-case-key-bindings
References: <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5.ref@Ergus>
<20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5@Ergus> <834k5vmvf0.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87czkhjtes.fsf@HIDDEN> <83wnipjohu.fsf@HIDDEN>
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Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2022 11:19:33 +0100
In-Reply-To: <83r18xjlrj.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Mon, 24 Jan
2022 15:39:28 +0200")
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>>>>> On Mon, 24 Jan 2022 15:39:28 +0200, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> said:
>> Why not?
Eli> Because people will probably want it applied to any key. There's
Eli> nothing special about letters, except that "upper-case" implicitly
Eli> refers to letters.
Let's start again:
Currently, S-<right> produces S-<right>, but is translated to <right>,
and C-S-a is translated to C-a
If you set translate-upper-case-key-bindings to nil, then S-<right>
produces S-<right>, and C-S-a produces C-S-a
So the effect is as if the option were called
'translate-shift-bindings', but that effect is not called out
anywhere.
So either we fix the behaviour, or the documentation. Would it be that
hard to restrict this to something like [a-z] or !function key? Or we
could always add yet-another-user-option.
Robert
--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#53452; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 53452) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Jan 2022 13:39:50 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jan 24 08:39:50 2022 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42554 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1nBzZV-0006W6-NK for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 24 Jan 2022 08:39:50 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:59830) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nBzZU-0006Vp-3w for 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 24 Jan 2022 08:39:48 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=36588 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nBzZO-0007AR-Pf; Mon, 24 Jan 2022 08:39:42 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=eIiSZ8HB+5BVrHNcRAnVu8kGftnk3t6HDf78/09IgCc=; b=m+4F5p8aLiEM dEEWS0/sXkMdAODRSn4pQKv19dB50VMhj7tlz49qSH1/kVqrAQKdn9NhdjMQ+xetJrCGm/G+tLKN3 YjR4026Tlu5ZsrW1gD/lsR85qI6uJ/TCKEP90UUyDseI6QD1AfRwydQqB1uKmALZY/kM9yhszMYNR QDUB5/ls38kvJfdn2AFab/VPGKM5l/1tiihL7PvY24LZGHp8UT+I4KxDPX+d2hncV7G+hTlTI0nJ/ BIpx6QPlIQokIUTgFXlN6TV2lwenzvTUzCHDWlBYF+ihkhlWsYhtXlFiLzb1n2kZkK54NfLOfPhPA 3StQg7vvj0/obaOi1R7/nA==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=4817 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nBzZN-0005oM-VR; Mon, 24 Jan 2022 08:39:42 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2022 15:39:28 +0200 Message-Id: <83r18xjlrj.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87pmohi818.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Robert Pluim on Mon, 24 Jan 2022 14:21:23 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#53452: 29.0.50; C-<arrow> selection broken by translate-upper-case-key-bindings References: <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5.ref@Ergus> <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5@Ergus> <834k5vmvf0.fsf@HIDDEN> <87czkhjtes.fsf@HIDDEN> <83wnipjohu.fsf@HIDDEN> <87pmohi818.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 53452 Cc: spacibba@HIDDEN, 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> > Cc: spacibba@HIDDEN, 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2022 14:21:23 +0100 > > >>>>> On Mon, 24 Jan 2022 14:40:29 +0200, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> said: > > >> From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> > >> Cc: Ergus <spacibba@HIDDEN>, 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > >> Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2022 11:54:19 +0100 > >> > Eli> It sounds like it cannot work in that case, because shift-select > Eli> _requires_ that a key was shift-translated, and setting > Eli> translate-upper-case-key-bindings to nil disables that translation. > >> > >> The docstring says: > >> "If non-nil, interpret upper case keys as lower case (when applicable)." > >> > >> which strongly implies that this only applies to letters, not keys > >> like <right> > > Eli> That's not the implementation, though. And I'm not sure applying it > Eli> only to letters would make sense. > > Why not? Because people will probably want it applied to any key. There's nothing special about letters, except that "upper-case" implicitly refers to letters.
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From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#53452: 29.0.50; C-<arrow> selection broken by
translate-upper-case-key-bindings
References: <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5.ref@Ergus>
<20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5@Ergus> <834k5vmvf0.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87czkhjtes.fsf@HIDDEN> <83wnipjohu.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2022 14:21:23 +0100
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2022 14:40:29 +0200")
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>>>>> On Mon, 24 Jan 2022 14:40:29 +0200, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> said:
>> From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
>> Cc: Ergus <spacibba@HIDDEN>, 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2022 11:54:19 +0100
>>=20
Eli> It sounds like it cannot work in that case, because shift-select
Eli> _requires_ that a key was shift-translated, and setting
Eli> translate-upper-case-key-bindings to nil disables that translation.
>>=20
>> The docstring says:
>> "If non-nil, interpret upper case keys as lower case (when applicabl=
e)."
>>=20
>> which strongly implies that this only applies to letters, not keys
>> like <right>
Eli> That's not the implementation, though. And I'm not sure applying =
it
Eli> only to letters would make sense.
Why not? non-letters don=CA=BCt have a case, they only have a potential
Shift modifier.
Robert
--=20
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From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#53452: 29.0.50; C-<arrow> selection broken by
translate-upper-case-key-bindings
References: <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5.ref@Ergus>
<20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5@Ergus> <834k5vmvf0.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87czkhjtes.fsf@HIDDEN> <83y235jokw.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2022 14:19:59 +0100
In-Reply-To: <83y235jokw.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Mon, 24 Jan
2022 14:38:39 +0200")
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>>>>> On Mon, 24 Jan 2022 14:38:39 +0200, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> said:
>> From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
>> Cc: Ergus <spacibba@HIDDEN>, 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2022 11:54:19 +0100
>>=20
Eli> It sounds like it cannot work in that case, because shift-select
Eli> _requires_ that a key was shift-translated, and setting
Eli> translate-upper-case-key-bindings to nil disables that translation.
>>=20
>> The docstring says:
>> "If non-nil, interpret upper case keys as lower case (when applicabl=
e)."
>>=20
>> which strongly implies that this only applies to letters, not keys
>> like <right>
Eli> That's a wrong impression, the translation applies to all the keys.
Yes, it does, but it=CA=BCs unexpected (to me at least), that setting
`translate-upper-case-key-bindings' to nil has the effect of disabling
that translation. I=CA=BCd expect to see that side effect described in the
docstring, but that only talks about upper<->lower case mapping.
Robert
--=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#53452; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 53452) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Jan 2022 12:41:35 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jan 24 07:41:35 2022 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42462 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1nByf9-0002dW-1Y for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 24 Jan 2022 07:41:35 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:45978) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nByf7-0002dK-SB for 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 24 Jan 2022 07:41:34 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=35444 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nByes-0005fz-3C; Mon, 24 Jan 2022 07:41:22 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=gphzGfc4mJnC10kzho4rSYp6NpQg7r0otdXPUJAxi6I=; b=AexEt9H+0Ux7 zJkHIoAz5N2d1tww5tlx/sjWyTnRdZLXMU+vQK4EAROugfzKl43/AhmbZDTHd/GhY5QZSAtBIfgr7 LQmpkobvH5h7IZSRpp0v8pYg2pAPO9zWAKyfPdVSIfnan78ZFY+M9gVrHIqfNNK7SDSAi+lM7UmYF yZwG+XxBexHOCjspe12xTAjHXa2e4AhXEM8K0P/NT2oEb1fM5SAGBYIcvEDQXv6+6H3akuhth0plD I1kiKpAQtBdGWVDleRo5+eTaVv/8FdnKdxtjQ4W1TXatM2bHQCvtlHwNchwa/VLKmniUlY4N2/av4 GdEFVyYu/Hctljr7zMdHEw==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=1038 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nByeH-0005uB-Mp; Mon, 24 Jan 2022 07:41:07 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2022 14:40:29 +0200 Message-Id: <83wnipjohu.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87czkhjtes.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Robert Pluim on Mon, 24 Jan 2022 11:54:19 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#53452: 29.0.50; C-<arrow> selection broken by translate-upper-case-key-bindings References: <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5.ref@Ergus> <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5@Ergus> <834k5vmvf0.fsf@HIDDEN> <87czkhjtes.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 53452 Cc: spacibba@HIDDEN, 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> > Cc: Ergus <spacibba@HIDDEN>, 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2022 11:54:19 +0100 > > Eli> It sounds like it cannot work in that case, because shift-select > Eli> _requires_ that a key was shift-translated, and setting > Eli> translate-upper-case-key-bindings to nil disables that translation. > > The docstring says: > "If non-nil, interpret upper case keys as lower case (when applicable)." > > which strongly implies that this only applies to letters, not keys > like <right> That's not the implementation, though. And I'm not sure applying it only to letters would make sense.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#53452; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 53452) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Jan 2022 12:39:42 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jan 24 07:39:42 2022 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42457 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1nByd5-0002a4-Pv for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 24 Jan 2022 07:39:42 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:45566) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nByd3-0002Zq-SS for 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 24 Jan 2022 07:39:26 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=35418 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nBycx-0005EA-8N; Mon, 24 Jan 2022 07:39:20 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=fQUns2Ik7sgoSfNeEl3VKlimjR1+9lHgj/0d8bC+dQ4=; b=rKXeVyeEBi4/ rFzLjK8GCukhMdxJ85OB+t0+HQkRoi1V3hUdTDcvn8NF1r4igHg9Z1TlTLt5BjcFW1ogFN5wx611Z oxYAqQyc3IbsvEL6WQ1xb6zc1RFToRyv86f0FySiU+Hiywz8fiVTHeztcS9u/iwpNqimQpKdcyeL2 u1uiCTDJVnVzntg4bRNpJ1sEDzsfToCXkjxFnt6ww1rSIYaE/suTVTi+8DLFKSbS3ybXIqI1nN+FY wH4NNfc3ns0Zmr/YMjR/ALWzb806sxqiGh2zPjcmXb9mcgm7UL1G3wdmWfLZOu+1fJWlZI7Mn8hCK Z5vN+Rt2qwD+MWyMDOSYpA==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=4903 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nBycV-0004ly-Vt; Mon, 24 Jan 2022 07:39:02 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2022 14:38:39 +0200 Message-Id: <83y235jokw.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87czkhjtes.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Robert Pluim on Mon, 24 Jan 2022 11:54:19 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#53452: 29.0.50; C-<arrow> selection broken by translate-upper-case-key-bindings References: <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5.ref@Ergus> <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5@Ergus> <834k5vmvf0.fsf@HIDDEN> <87czkhjtes.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 53452 Cc: spacibba@HIDDEN, 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) > From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> > Cc: Ergus <spacibba@HIDDEN>, 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2022 11:54:19 +0100 > > Eli> It sounds like it cannot work in that case, because shift-select > Eli> _requires_ that a key was shift-translated, and setting > Eli> translate-upper-case-key-bindings to nil disables that translation. > > The docstring says: > "If non-nil, interpret upper case keys as lower case (when applicable)." > > which strongly implies that this only applies to letters, not keys > like <right> That's a wrong impression, the translation applies to all the keys.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#53452; Package emacs.
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From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#53452: 29.0.50; C-<arrow> selection broken by
translate-upper-case-key-bindings
References: <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5.ref@Ergus>
<20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5@Ergus> <834k5vmvf0.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2022 11:54:19 +0100
In-Reply-To: <834k5vmvf0.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 22 Jan
2022 21:18:11 +0200")
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>>>>> On Sat, 22 Jan 2022 21:18:11 +0200, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> said:
>> Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2022 19:26:35 +0100
>> From: Ergus via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs,
>> the Swiss army knife of text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN>
>>
>> When translate-upper-case-key-bindings is nil; the shift-arrow selection
>> does not work
>>
>> emacs -Q
>> M-: (setq translate-upper-case-key-bindings nil)
>> S-<right> // says it is not bound... somehow expected.
>>
>> M-: (keymap-global-set "S-<right>" #'right-char)
>> S-<right> // Now moves point but with no selection
>>
>> I don't know where/how emacs recognizes the Shift in this case, but
>> somehow it is not working
Eli> It sounds like it cannot work in that case, because shift-select
Eli> _requires_ that a key was shift-translated, and setting
Eli> translate-upper-case-key-bindings to nil disables that translation.
The docstring says:
"If non-nil, interpret upper case keys as lower case (when applicable)."
which strongly implies that this only applies to letters, not keys
like <right>
Robert
--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#53452; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 53452) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Jan 2022 19:18:38 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sat Jan 22 14:18:38 2022 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37929 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1nBLuI-000405-2M for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Jan 2022 14:18:38 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:42778) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nBLuH-0003zr-8f for 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Jan 2022 14:18:37 -0500 Received: from [2001:470:142:3::e] (port=56990 helo=fencepost.gnu.org) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nBLuA-0007sh-NQ; Sat, 22 Jan 2022 14:18:31 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=qz2j/DvCqeA4HScOg5mDUDXT/ZQbmmn2bxC4qe4FWtE=; b=lscCwSKxINVL LkF87cfw1JEC16hEBeXywB6Tn2e4/sez0KDYlsfjvfxD2xMK50ihC1D3fFKdPM/3wn3H+Qu6+kkqG vZ+GqV9NemHoKovkXUv2eW2VQvzL2S0vrtdlxevfM2sNpsB2sP1MENO6wxoSSqHoYLNeA/icgW8QK o/kDUJf7WBJVA86W9rNDihBi8XOeL42hSjMIxQndGxe8lEh+eId+UXJjkGOo4pon6MNi7nC1rqTGy +C93SjqQPhuKqv8gDZGdh5EB69onTuu4/WNtr4C1WnUdyzbuG+qxVXwTMq14PwpJ2EeBW/4gT4Ao5 MMMQN0t5Um+ejpgQTx5pAg==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (port=4061 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1nBLuA-0003ss-67; Sat, 22 Jan 2022 14:18:30 -0500 Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2022 21:18:11 +0200 Message-Id: <834k5vmvf0.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Ergus <spacibba@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5@Ergus> (bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN) Subject: Re: bug#53452: 29.0.50; C-<arrow> selection broken by translate-upper-case-key-bindings References: <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5.ref@Ergus> <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5@Ergus> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 53452 Cc: 53452 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2022 19:26:35 +0100 > From: Ergus via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, > the Swiss army knife of text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> > > When translate-upper-case-key-bindings is nil; the shift-arrow selection > does not work > > emacs -Q > M-: (setq translate-upper-case-key-bindings nil) > S-<right> // says it is not bound... somehow expected. > > M-: (keymap-global-set "S-<right>" #'right-char) > S-<right> // Now moves point but with no selection > > I don't know where/how emacs recognizes the Shift in this case, but > somehow it is not working It sounds like it cannot work in that case, because shift-select _requires_ that a key was shift-translated, and setting translate-upper-case-key-bindings to nil disables that translation.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#53452; Package emacs.
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Sat, 22 Jan 2022 18:27:13 +0000 Received: by kubenode506.mail-prod1.omega.ir2.yahoo.com (VZM Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 36860153e9cefb2250b6ecaaf6ed1506; Sat, 22 Jan 2022 18:27:10 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2022 19:26:35 +0100 From: Ergus <spacibba@HIDDEN> To: bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN Subject: 29.0.50; C-<arrow> selection broken by translate-upper-case-key-bindings Message-ID: <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5@Ergus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline References: <20220122182635.hi7i2alow4ishyz5.ref@Ergus> X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.19615 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.aol Content-Length: 7827 Received-SPF: pass client-ip=74.6.130.41; envelope-from=spacibba@HIDDEN; helo=sonic308-2.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) Hi: When translate-upper-case-key-bindings is nil; the shift-arrow selection does not work emacs -Q M-: (setq translate-upper-case-key-bindings nil) S-<right> // says it is not bound... somehow expected. M-: (keymap-global-set "S-<right>" #'right-char) S-<right> // Now moves point but with no selection I don't know where/how emacs recognizes the Shift in this case, but somehow it is not working Best, In GNU Emacs 29.0.50 (build 42, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.24.31, cairo version 1.17.4) of 2022-01-21 built on Ergus Repository revision: 1228ec3e1d7657c9eb50184719410f37ed0eb750 Repository branch: master System Description: Arch Linux Configured using: 'configure --prefix=/home/ergo/.local/ --with-mailutils --with-json --with-x-toolkit=gtk3 --with-xft --with-wide-int --with-modules --with-cairo --with-harfbuzz --with-native-compilation --with-pgtk' Configured features: ACL CAIRO DBUS FREETYPE GIF GLIB GMP GNUTLS GPM GSETTINGS HARFBUZZ JPEG JSON LCMS2 LIBSYSTEMD LIBXML2 MODULES NATIVE_COMP NOTIFY INOTIFY PDUMPER PGTK PNG RSVG SECCOMP SOUND SQLITE3 THREADS TIFF TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS WEBP XIM GTK3 ZLIB Important settings: value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8 locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix Major mode: Lisp Interaction Minor modes in effect: global-auto-revert-mode: t xclip-mode: t yas-global-mode: t yas-minor-mode: t electric-pair-mode: t flyspell-mode: t company-mode: t flycheck-mode: t counsel-mode: t ivy-mode: t composable-mark-mode: t composable-mode: t repeat-mode: t xterm-mouse-mode: t minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode: t winner-mode: t save-place-mode: t which-key-mode: t override-global-mode: t delete-selection-mode: t savehist-mode: t global-display-fill-column-indicator-mode: t display-fill-column-indicator-mode: t global-display-line-numbers-mode: t display-line-numbers-mode: t eldoc-mode: t show-paren-mode: t mouse-wheel-mode: t file-name-shadow-mode: t context-menu-mode: t global-font-lock-mode: t font-lock-mode: t blink-cursor-mode: t auto-composition-mode: t auto-encryption-mode: t auto-compression-mode: t size-indication-mode: t column-number-mode: t line-number-mode: t indent-tabs-mode: t transient-mark-mode: t Load-path shadows: ~/gits/emacs_clones/composable/composable-mark hides /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/composable-20201024.1458/composable-mark ~/gits/emacs_clones/composable/composable hides /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/composable-20201024.1458/composable /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/transient-20220117.1122/transient hides /home/ergo/.local/share/emacs/29.0.50/lisp/transient /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-jump hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-jump /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-hello hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-hello /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-query hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-query /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-show hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-show /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-parser hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-parser /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/cmake-mode-20210104.1831/cmake-mode hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/cmake-mode /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-wash hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-wash /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/protobuf-mode-20211013.1726/protobuf-mode hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/protobuf-mode /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-crypto hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-crypto /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-tree hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-tree /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/coolj hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/coolj /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-lib hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-lib /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-compat hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-compat /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-company hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-company /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-draft hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-draft /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-tag hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-tag /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-message hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-message /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-mua hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-mua /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-address hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-address /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-print hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-print /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch /home/ergo/.config/emacs/elpa/notmuch-20220120.1932/notmuch-maildir-fcc hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-maildir-fcc Features: (shadow sort mail-extr emacsbug message mailcap yank-media rmc puny rfc822 mml mml-sec password-cache epa derived epg rfc6068 epg-config gnus-util time-date mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode mail-parse rfc2231 mailabbrev gmm-utils mailheader sendmail rfc2047 rfc2045 ietf-drums mm-util mail-prsvr mail-utils thingatpt amx s autorevert filenotify xclip yasnippet-snippets yasnippet elec-pair flyspell-correct-ivy flyspell-correct flyspell ispell company-semantic company-template company-capf company flycheck json map find-func dash pcase cape counsel xdg xref project dired dired-loaddefs compile text-property-search comint ansi-color swiper ivy-avy avy ivy flx ivy-faces ivy-overlay colir term/tmux term/xterm xterm init composable composable-mark powerline comp comp-cstr warnings advice powerline-separators color powerline-themes repeat xt-mouse edmacro kmacro mb-depth simple-16-theme winner ring saveplace diminish which-key cl-extra help-mode use-package use-package-ensure use-package-delight use-package-diminish use-package-bind-key bind-key use-package-core disp-table delsel savehist easy-mmode display-fill-column-indicator display-line-numbers info ede/auto eieio-base cl-seq seq eieio subr-x byte-opt bytecomp byte-compile cconv eieio-core cl-macs gv eieio-loaddefs cl-loaddefs cl-lib tex-site rx slime-autoloads early-init iso-transl tooltip eldoc paren electric uniquify ediff-hook vc-hooks lisp-float-type elisp-mode mwheel term/pgtk-win pgtk-win term/common-win tool-bar dnd fontset image regexp-opt fringe tabulated-list replace newcomment text-mode lisp-mode prog-mode register page tab-bar menu-bar rfn-eshadow isearch easymenu timer select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock font-lock syntax font-core term/tty-colors frame minibuffer cl-generic cham georgian utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao korean japanese eucjp-ms cp51932 hebrew greek romanian slovak czech european ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese composite emoji-zwj charscript charprop case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help simple abbrev obarray cl-preloaded nadvice button loaddefs faces cus-face macroexp files window text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages mule custom widget keymap hashtable-print-readable backquote threads dbusbind inotify dynamic-setting system-font-setting font-render-setting cairo move-toolbar gtk x-toolkit pgtk lcms2 multi-tty make-network-process native-compile emacs) Memory information: ((conses 16 269329 16379) (symbols 48 18331 0) (strings 32 70803 7968) (string-bytes 1 2271188) (vectors 16 30164) (vector-slots 8 636227 5879) (floats 8 197 995) (intervals 56 1611 0) (buffers 992 10))
Ergus <spacibba@HIDDEN>:bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN.
Full text available.bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#53452; Package emacs.
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Copyright (C) 1999 Darren O. Benham,
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