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charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73928 Cc: Gnulib bugs <bug-gnulib@HIDDEN>, 1080330@HIDDEN, Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN>, Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN>, Michael Stone <mstone@HIDDEN>, 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) On Mon, Feb 17, 2025 at 10:08=E2=80=AFAM Paul Eggert <eggert@HIDDEN> w= rote: > Even if it's that simple, something is updating the traditional > /var/run/utmp and /var/log/wtmp files on Fedora and Ubuntu and at least > in some cases they work better than systemd does and this should be > fixed somehow. Applications are doing that via glibc. But this will go away with glibc 2.42, when this functions don't do anything anymore. And this will not happen if distributions don't create /run/utmp on boot. glibc only writes to this files if they exist, it will not create them. Thorsten --=20 Thorsten Kukuk, Distinguished Engineer, Senior Architect, Future Technologi= es SUSE Software Solutions Germany GmbH, Frankenstra=C3=9Fe 146, 90461 Nuernberg, Germany Managing Director: Ivo Totev, Andrew McDonald, Werner Knoblich (HRB 36809, AG N=C3=BCrnberg)
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
Full text available.Received: (at 73928) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 Feb 2025 09:25:25 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Feb 17 04:25:25 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42828 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tjxNV-0000H6-GK for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 17 Feb 2025 04:25:25 -0500 Received: from joooj.vinc17.net ([155.133.131.76]:44188) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <vincent@HIDDEN>) id 1tjxNS-0000Gf-SL for 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 17 Feb 2025 04:25:23 -0500 Received: from smtp-qaa.vinc17.net (135.197.67.86.rev.sfr.net [86.67.197.135]) by joooj.vinc17.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id CD08B1BB; Mon, 17 Feb 2025 10:25:20 +0100 (CET) Received: by qaa.vinc17.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 572F5CA00C3; Mon, 17 Feb 2025 10:25:20 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2025 10:25:20 +0100 From: Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN> To: Thorsten Kukuk <kukuk@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#73928: Bug#1080330: coreutils: who no longer works Message-ID: <20250217092520.GK154386@HIDDEN> References: <CAEsAu2O7WPJ3NsCs2H2=ypVbRiN2PwROJYOm4G9ZU1L6QNqk1A@HIDDEN> <20240920152411.GA2199@HIDDEN> <Z7ImqgD2EAZS5ztL@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20250216180513.GC154386@HIDDEN> <c94cd41a-ecae-11ef-9b6a-00163eeb5320@HIDDEN> <36612a40-147b-446c-801e-ab86aceebbcb@HIDDEN> <CABMvmLv1NzXqi8SUWu0Rm=A_Dc7Va2Q=5mpg81iTHo_YOW_7JA@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <CABMvmLv1NzXqi8SUWu0Rm=A_Dc7Va2Q=5mpg81iTHo_YOW_7JA@HIDDEN> X-Mailer-Info: https://www.vinc17.net/mutt/ User-Agent: Mutt/2.2.13+86 (bb2064ae) vl-169878 (2025-02-08) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73928 Cc: 1080330@HIDDEN, Paul Eggert <eggert@HIDDEN>, Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN>, 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Michael Stone <mstone@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) On 2025-02-17 08:03:23 +0100, Thorsten Kukuk wrote: > Some terminal applications (e.g. xterm, konsole, ...) create fake utmp > entries for historic reasons: so that broadcast messages are shown in > every single terminal. Which for people, who only work with graphical > applications, but not terminals, is not from help, as they will never > see them. No, there may be other uses. For instance, "who -d" reports information about dead terminal processes. Obviously, this is not for broadcast messages (more for debugging purpose, IMHO). However, for xterm at least, the output information is incorrect (term & exit values are always 0). "who -u" also reports useful information, such as the idle time and the PID of the terminal process. The absence of utmp completely breaks this feature. -- Vincent Lefèvre <vincent@HIDDEN> - Web: <https://www.vinc17.net/> 100% accessible validated (X)HTML - Blog: <https://www.vinc17.net/blog/> Work: CR INRIA - computer arithmetic / Pascaline project (LIP, ENS-Lyon)
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
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The systemd versions are reasonably recent. Fedora 41 has systemd 256.11 (2025-01-08) and Ubuntu 24.10 has systemd 256.5 (2024-08-31). Here are the details: On Fedora 41, "systemctl --version" reports: systemd 256 (256.11-1.fc41) +PAM +AUDIT +SELINUX -APPARMOR +IMA +SMACK +SECCOMP -GCRYPT +GNUTLS +OPENSSL +ACL +BLKID +CURL +ELFUTILS +FIDO2 +IDN2 -IDN -IPTC +KMOD +LIBCRYPTSETUP +LIBCRYPTSETUP_PLUGINS +LIBFDISK +PCRE2 +PWQUALITY +P11KIT +QRENCODE +TPM2 +BZIP2 +LZ4 +XZ +ZLIB +ZSTD +BPF_FRAMEWORK +XKBCOMMON +UTMP +SYSVINIT +LIBARCHIVE On Ubuntu 24.10, the same command reports: systemd 256 (256.5-2ubuntu3.1) +PAM +AUDIT +SELINUX +APPARMOR +IMA +SMACK +SECCOMP +GCRYPT -GNUTLS +OPENSSL +ACL +BLKID +CURL +ELFUTILS +FIDO2 +IDN2 -IDN +IPTC +KMOD +LIBCRYPTSETUP +LIBCRYPTSETUP_PLUGINS +LIBFDISK +PCRE2 +PWQUALITY +P11KIT +QRENCODE +TPM2 +BZIP2 +LZ4 +XZ +ZLIB +ZSTD +BPF_FRAMEWORK -XKBCOMMON +UTMP +SYSVINIT +LIBARCHIVE > systemd only writes the boot time, nothing else. Is it that simple? systemd/src/core/exec-invoke.c's exec_invoke seems to do more than that if ENABLE_UTMP is defined. Even if it's that simple, something is updating the traditional /var/run/utmp and /var/log/wtmp files on Fedora and Ubuntu and at least in some cases they work better than systemd does and this should be fixed somehow.
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
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In that case, should we fix Gnulib and/or Coreutils so that the first output is changed to match the second one? >> $ ./who-no-systemd >> eggert pts/3 2025-02-16 22:56 (47.147.225.25) >> $ ./who-with-systemd >> gdm seat0 2025-02-13 18:04 >> gdm tty1 2025-02-13 18:04 >> eggert sshd pts/3 2025-02-16 22:56 (47.147.225.25) >> >> Here, though I'm logged in only via ssh, the libsystemd-using 'who' >> incorrectly reports that a user named "gdm" is logged in in person. > > 'who' merely reports the info it got from systemd-logind, and systemd-logind > most probably got a notification from gdm. > > I agree with you that this _looks_like_ as if a user named 'gdm' was logged > in, and thus is misleading. But I don't think this should be fixed in > coreutils. Rather, this is something to work out between systemd-logind > and gdm. OK, but until that's worked out it appears to be better to not use --enable-systemd on Fedora when configuring Coreutils. Likewise for Ubuntu which has the same issue, and I assume Debian is like Ubuntu.
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
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charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73928 Cc: Gnulib bugs <bug-gnulib@HIDDEN>, 1080330@HIDDEN, Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN>, Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN>, Michael Stone <mstone@HIDDEN>, 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) On Mon, Feb 17, 2025 at 8:40=E2=80=AFAM Paul Eggert <eggert@HIDDEN> wr= ote: > > On 2025-02-16 23:03, Thorsten Kukuk wrote: > > The problems were already all solved with the first coreutils versions > > having systemd-logind support. Even with all the bug reports I don't > > see a need for changes in Coreutils, only in distributions not > > enabling systemd-logind support in all packages. > > Thanks for the summary. Unfortunately I'm not seeing all the problems > solved, at least not on current Fedora (41) and Ubuntu (24.10). > > If I configure current (f2e323430193956709aacca33f6b4fcab4fb9d8b) > Coreutils with --enable-systemd on my Ubuntu 24.10 desktop, the output > gets worse: > > $ ./who-no-systemd # Configured normally. > eggert seat0 2025-02-15 10:11 (login screen) > eggert tty2 2025-02-15 10:11 (tty2) > $ ./who-with-systemd # Configured with --enable-systemd. > eggert seat0 2025-02-15 10:11 > eggert tty2 2025-02-15 10:11 > > Apparently for coreutils, /var/run/utmp (the traditional interface) has > more info than libsystemd's API. (For what it's worth, both versions of > "who" consult /var/run/utmp on Ubuntu 24.10, but the systemd version > also consults /run/systemd/sessions/*.) systemd-logind provides the same info as utmp does, I made sure that this is the case and available: https://github.com/thkukuk/utmpx/blob/main/utmp-to-logind.md And who (with --enable-systemd with no /run/utmp on openSUSE Tumbleweed): On a server: kukuk pts/3 2025-02-12 11:20 (192.168.122.1) kukuk pts/0 2025-02-11 12:00 (192.168.122.1) kukuk pts/1 2025-02-11 14:26 (192.168.122.1) On my local machine with KDE: kukuk seat0 2025-02-11 15:58 (:0) kukuk tty2 2025-02-11 15:58 (:0) root pts/2 2025-02-15 18:32 No idea why this is not working for you. On openSUSE we have no additional patches which are not upstream. Maybe that systemd version is too old on that systems? > Similarly, on a Fedora 41 desktop where I'm not currently logged in, I > get inferior results when Coreutils is configured with --enable-systemd: > > $ ./who-no-systemd > eggert pts/3 2025-02-16 22:56 (47.147.225.25) > $ ./who-with-systemd > gdm seat0 2025-02-13 18:04 > gdm tty1 2025-02-13 18:04 > eggert sshd pts/3 2025-02-16 22:56 (47.147.225.25) > > Here, though I'm logged in only via ssh, the libsystemd-using 'who' > incorrectly reports that a user named "gdm" is logged in in person. > > My guess is that, once systemd was changed to continue to output via the > traditional /var/run/utmp and /var/log/wtmp files, people stopped > configuring coreutils with --enable-systemd and stopped worrying about > making sure that the more-modern systemd API works, which means that the > traditional files are still essential. systemd only writes the boot time, nothing else. Thorsten --=20 Thorsten Kukuk, Distinguished Engineer, Senior Architect, Future Technologi= es SUSE Software Solutions Germany GmbH, Frankenstra=C3=9Fe 146, 90461 Nuernberg, Germany Managing Director: Ivo Totev, Andrew McDonald, Werner Knoblich (HRB 36809, AG N=C3=BCrnberg)
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
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From: Bruno Haible <bruno@HIDDEN>
To: bug-gnulib@HIDDEN, Paul Eggert <eggert@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#73928: Bug#1080330: coreutils: who no longer works
Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2025 09:12:31 +0100
Message-ID: <7736094.oDFzTOozpa@nimes>
Organization: GNU
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Cc: 1080330@HIDDEN, Thorsten Kukuk <kukuk@HIDDEN>,
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Paul Eggert wrote:
> If I configure current (f2e323430193956709aacca33f6b4fcab4fb9d8b)
> Coreutils with --enable-systemd on my Ubuntu 24.10 desktop, the output
> gets worse:
>
> $ ./who-no-systemd # Configured normally.
> eggert seat0 2025-02-15 10:11 (login screen)
> eggert tty2 2025-02-15 10:11 (tty2)
> $ ./who-with-systemd # Configured with --enable-systemd.
> eggert seat0 2025-02-15 10:11
> eggert tty2 2025-02-15 10:11
>
> Apparently for coreutils, /var/run/utmp (the traditional interface) has
> more info than libsystemd's API.
Both outputs are equivalent; the second one is less redundant.
- The comment "(tty2)" is redundant because it's already the tty.
- The comment "(login screen)" is redundant because that's the
concept of a "seat".
> Similarly, on a Fedora 41 desktop where I'm not currently logged in, I
> get inferior results when Coreutils is configured with --enable-systemd:
>
> $ ./who-no-systemd
> eggert pts/3 2025-02-16 22:56 (47.147.225.25)
> $ ./who-with-systemd
> gdm seat0 2025-02-13 18:04
> gdm tty1 2025-02-13 18:04
> eggert sshd pts/3 2025-02-16 22:56 (47.147.225.25)
>
> Here, though I'm logged in only via ssh, the libsystemd-using 'who'
> incorrectly reports that a user named "gdm" is logged in in person.
'who' merely reports the info it got from systemd-logind, and systemd-logind
most probably got a notification from gdm.
I agree with you that this _looks_like_ as if a user named 'gdm' was logged
in, and thus is misleading. But I don't think this should be fixed in
coreutils. Rather, this is something to work out between systemd-logind
and gdm.
Bruno
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
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Subject: Re: bug#73928: Bug#1080330: coreutils: who no longer works
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Content preview: On 2025-02-16 23:03, Thorsten Kukuk wrote: > The problems
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On 2025-02-16 23:03, Thorsten Kukuk wrote:
> The problems were already all solved with the first coreutils versions
> having systemd-logind support. Even with all the bug reports I don't
> see a need for changes in Coreutils, only in distributions not
> enabling systemd-logind support in all packages.
Thanks for the summary. Unfortunately I'm not seeing all the problems
solved, at least not on current Fedora (41) and Ubuntu (24.10).
If I configure current (f2e323430193956709aacca33f6b4fcab4fb9d8b)
Coreutils with --enable-systemd on my Ubuntu 24.10 desktop, the output
gets worse:
$ ./who-no-systemd # Configured normally.
eggert seat0 2025-02-15 10:11 (login screen)
eggert tty2 2025-02-15 10:11 (tty2)
$ ./who-with-systemd # Configured with --enable-systemd.
eggert seat0 2025-02-15 10:11
eggert tty2 2025-02-15 10:11
Apparently for coreutils, /var/run/utmp (the traditional interface) has
more info than libsystemd's API. (For what it's worth, both versions of
"who" consult /var/run/utmp on Ubuntu 24.10, but the systemd version
also consults /run/systemd/sessions/*.)
Similarly, on a Fedora 41 desktop where I'm not currently logged in, I
get inferior results when Coreutils is configured with --enable-systemd:
$ ./who-no-systemd
eggert pts/3 2025-02-16 22:56 (47.147.225.25)
$ ./who-with-systemd
gdm seat0 2025-02-13 18:04
gdm tty1 2025-02-13 18:04
eggert sshd pts/3 2025-02-16 22:56 (47.147.225.25)
Here, though I'm logged in only via ssh, the libsystemd-using 'who'
incorrectly reports that a user named "gdm" is logged in in person.
My guess is that, once systemd was changed to continue to output via the
traditional /var/run/utmp and /var/log/wtmp files, people stopped
configuring coreutils with --enable-systemd and stopped worrying about
making sure that the more-modern systemd API works, which means that the
traditional files are still essential.
I'll add bug-gnulib to the cc list as this may be a Gnulib issue.
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
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On Sun, Feb 16, 2025 at 11:52=E2=80=AFPM Paul Eggert <eggert@HIDDEN> w= rote: > > At this point I confess I don't know what changes would be needed for > GNU 'who'. I see a difference of opinion as to whether 'w' works. There > seem to be multiple mechanisms in play (utmp, wtmp, wtmpdb, lastlog2, > logind, maybe others?) and I don't know when to use which, or even how > to use them except for the traditional utmp/wtmp files. Let's give a short summary: lastlog from util-linux got replaced with lastlog2. There were very few applications creating lastlog entries and using them to display the last login message. This code can be removed, this is handled now by pam_lastlog2.so, so that all applications have support for it. I'm not aware of any utility outside of util-linux who reads the lastlog file for different reasons. wtmpdb replaces /var/log/wtmp. Applications, who just created wtmp entries: this code can be disabled, we have now pam_wtmpdb.so to create common, correct wtmp entries. Applications who did read wtmp files for whatever reasons need to be adjusted to use wtmpdb. But again, this don't really exist. Majority of applications only create the login/logout entries, which is now handled by the PAM module. The other two cases were runlevel management of SysVinit and entries for synchronizing the local clock. runlevel entries are not used by systemd and there is no tool left which creates entries to synchronize the clock for at least two decades. If your application did not read wtmp entries in the past, there is absolutely no reason to add wtmpdb support. Especially as wtmpdb is not a replacement for utmp. utmp: utmp got replaced by systemd-logind. Code which creates utmp entries can be removed, this is now handled by systemd-logind. Applications reading utmp need to be adjusted to use libsystemd. There is no file based access for utmp anymore (ok, not fully correct, systemd-logind stores the data on disk) and lastlog2 and wtmpdb are no file based replacements for utmp as what was wrongly claimed in one of the bug reports. So if your application was using utmp, it needs to use systemd-logind today and not lastlog2 or wtmpdb. Now to the bug reports, there are two different things: 1. Looks like w is compiled with libsystemd support, who is not. Compiling who with libsystemd support should already solve most of the problems as Chris Hofstaedtler already wrote. 2. fake utmp entries created by terminal applications don't work anymore. Some terminal applications (e.g. xterm, konsole, ...) create fake utmp entries for historic reasons: so that broadcast messages are shown in every single terminal. Which for people, who only work with graphical applications, but not terminals, is not from help, as they will never see them. This is for most users very annoying, that's why the other half does not create such entries. GNOME e.g. did never create such fake utmp entries, the claims of some people in that bug reports are wrong. Even worse: the utmp entries created by GNOME are partly broken, that's why wall does not work on most GNOME systems which use utmp and not systemd-logind at all. The fake utmp entries are no longer created with systemd-logind. For the majority of people in the discussions and at conferences this was a plus. KDE e.g. has a daemon, which listens to wall messages and shows them exactly once in one window. So that even people not using a terminal get them. But to be honest, I don't know what the state here is. But at least on openSUSE nobody noticed that the fake utmp entries are gone, and the majority of who noticed is happy that they are gone. Future: glibc 2.42 will remove support for utmp and wtmp according to the current plans. This is the only remaining open issue in openSUSE with the switch away from utmp and wtmp. Latest with this all applications should use systemd-logind and wtmpdb as replacement. > Perhaps whoever has changed the longstanding API (is that Thorsten > Kukuk, or someone else? anyway I'll cc Thorsten) can chime in with a > proposed patch to bleeding-edge GNU coreutils. This would probably mean > a patch to Gnulib's readutmp module, which already is supposed to work > with systemd's new utmp interfaces but I guess some people are reporting > problems with it? (This is unclear.) > > For what it's worth, I briefly looked at > <https://build.opensuse.org/package/show/openSUSE%3AFactory/coreutils> > and didn't see a patch there. So perhaps the problem is already > addressed in bleeding-edge Coreutils? The problems were already all solved with the first coreutils versions having systemd-logind support. Even with all the bug reports I don't see a need for changes in Coreutils, only in distributions not enabling systemd-logind support in all packages. Having a mix of applications using utmp or systemd-logind is not helpful, they all need to use the same backend. > Without some actionable advice from experts in this area, I don't see > this portability issue being fixed any time soon. > > For now, I've merged the following GNU Coreutils bug reports as they all > seem to be the same topic. > > https://bugs.gnu.org/73928 > https://bugs.gnu.org/76346 > https://bugs.gnu.org/76347 Yes, see above, all are based on the same two problems. I hope this helped, Thoresten --=20 Thorsten Kukuk, Distinguished Engineer, Senior Architect, Future Technologi= es SUSE Software Solutions Germany GmbH, Frankenstra=C3=9Fe 146, 90461 Nuernberg, Germany Managing Director: Ivo Totev, Andrew McDonald, Werner Knoblich (HRB 36809, AG N=C3=BCrnberg)
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
Full text available.Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN>
to control <at> debbugs.gnu.org.
Full text available.Received: (at 73928) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 Feb 2025 05:01:29 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Feb 17 00:01:29 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40966 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tjtG4-0000Or-92 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 17 Feb 2025 00:01:29 -0500 Received: from stravinsky.debian.org ([2001:41b8:202:deb::311:108]:37754) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <zeha@HIDDEN>) id 1tjnjC-0004oQ-6g for 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 18:07:12 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=debian.org; s=smtpauto.stravinsky; h=X-Debian-User:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version: References:Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To:From:Date:Reply-To: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description; bh=n2Pq7/MWRSonarqIdhIYamEzTRT/bh8rI+2ceOoxsXc=; b=TOsHPW/MnjR9CB1VynWdMvflfH 1htT4gWhT3hPnumP9SkST31h6JcfymSLjLIlzTG2bMO1KeKuXyWa4JcP1n5fXAbExdKX0Pj0LUeCY rPgZbaOB/6jIO2SpFL7pYnOR5FBAGHJifMyBczyx4A7il64MSALEpjllLRCmdmFX9UhMr1OKzRX+I stqDTTx9+hz0/A5M0fxZ6dUC/YZoJL4c4YQVSYmr8HWPmmVjjMVESSvUHFnLM1mdeUc+v1MjxU2Hy 3+z1MSbr1SL+oCdSIr3NibvDFgcdp4/SkgvI+KszwizsXMYDEQJNYUnmqn5ic449r0TUl6Cb1rn5k lXuRnbgA==; Received: from authenticated user by stravinsky.debian.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_X25519__RSA_PSS_RSAE_SHA256__AES_256_GCM:256) (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from <zeha@HIDDEN>) id 1tjnj5-00BYRW-I6; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 23:07:04 +0000 Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2025 00:07:02 +0100 From: Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN> To: Paul Eggert <eggert@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#73928: Bug#1080330: coreutils: who no longer works Message-ID: <wleskkmp5e4wvfo52i2pmhtj5fb6sae6gyoktg62oml6dvpfoi@sgtakx32osyy> References: <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <CAEsAu2O7WPJ3NsCs2H2=ypVbRiN2PwROJYOm4G9ZU1L6QNqk1A@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20240920152411.GA2199@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <Z7ImqgD2EAZS5ztL@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20250216180513.GC154386@HIDDEN> <c94cd41a-ecae-11ef-9b6a-00163eeb5320@HIDDEN> <36612a40-147b-446c-801e-ab86aceebbcb@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <36612a40-147b-446c-801e-ab86aceebbcb@HIDDEN> X-Debian-User: zeha X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73928 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 17 Feb 2025 00:01:09 -0500 Cc: Thorsten Kukuk <kukuk@HIDDEN>, 1080330@HIDDEN, Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN>, 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Michael Stone <mstone@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) * Paul Eggert <eggert@HIDDEN> [250216 23:52]: > At this point I confess I don't know what changes would be needed for GNU > 'who'. I see a difference of opinion as to whether 'w' works. There seem to > be multiple mechanisms in play (utmp, wtmp, wtmpdb, lastlog2, logind, maybe > others?) and I don't know when to use which, or even how to use them except > for the traditional utmp/wtmp files. > > Perhaps whoever has changed the longstanding API (is that Thorsten Kukuk, or > someone else? anyway I'll cc Thorsten) can chime in with a proposed patch to > bleeding-edge GNU coreutils. This would probably mean a patch to Gnulib's > readutmp module, which already is supposed to work with systemd's new utmp > interfaces but I guess some people are reporting problems with it? (This is > unclear.) > > For what it's worth, I briefly looked at > <https://build.opensuse.org/package/show/openSUSE%3AFactory/coreutils> and > didn't see a patch there. So perhaps the problem is already addressed in > bleeding-edge Coreutils? Looks like if Debian would build coreutils with --enable-systemd, it would just work: https://sources.debian.org/src/coreutils/9.5-1/lib/readutmp.c/?hl=678#L678 Chris
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
Full text available.Received: (at 73928) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 Feb 2025 05:01:20 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Feb 17 00:01:20 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40962 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tjtFu-0000Ng-8n for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 17 Feb 2025 00:01:20 -0500 Received: from stravinsky.debian.org ([2001:41b8:202:deb::311:108]:48574) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <zeha@HIDDEN>) id 1tjnZA-0003zu-Hp for 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 17:56:49 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=debian.org; s=smtpauto.stravinsky; h=X-Debian-User:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version: References:Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To:From:Date:Reply-To: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description; bh=URN78oP1iol3uKNohEwBVPKgLZZ8Ruf0avwl/5Ueyr4=; b=bcK2fh1cZ5bqwpl/0ehi55E/LD LTaH3r4KMqjOmQmGrrHE3+k3Ntm7O5JbQwMNNR60zohlG13Rp+RabBGsgVDp38TmxFdnIv9gRItcF jxR2c7pdKiW/Jr2HT6FTf06H50N87msUNqHvX4tOJI1f3pR94QYZ0skxxZ9SMslLVkFVQ9fRrnnaz HkQTjRLlytdPuPJPEUE/Xk96DAihpojmFA2gR7OLW4WjArz9U/xusf/GvjoD0mohf35xscNkZILTh CmFxytiiG4zQDh/JsnDQxppsQo66icArk/s8IqRHYz4Ty0+7hXmeYrFnnka66iM2Smszg9HozZWs/ Cm5+4cMg==; Received: from authenticated user by stravinsky.debian.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_X25519__RSA_PSS_RSAE_SHA256__AES_256_GCM:256) (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from <zeha@HIDDEN>) id 1tjnZ7-00BY6N-8k; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 22:56:45 +0000 Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2025 23:56:43 +0100 From: Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN> To: Michael Stone <mstone@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: Bug#1080330: coreutils: who no longer works Message-ID: <fuzctfnvvus3xtzxs6fx6wbbgmjebzmr2mwlz7kcy57dcwxxxo@cwp6jtilg3ew> References: <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <CAEsAu2O7WPJ3NsCs2H2=ypVbRiN2PwROJYOm4G9ZU1L6QNqk1A@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20240920152411.GA2199@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <Z7ImqgD2EAZS5ztL@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20250216180513.GC154386@HIDDEN> <c94cd41a-ecae-11ef-9b6a-00163eeb5320@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <c94cd41a-ecae-11ef-9b6a-00163eeb5320@HIDDEN> X-Debian-User: zeha X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73928 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Mon, 17 Feb 2025 00:01:09 -0500 Cc: Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN>, 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, 1080330@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) * Michael Stone <mstone@HIDDEN> [250216 22:45]: > On Sun, Feb 16, 2025 at 07:05:13PM +0100, Vincent Lefevre wrote: > > No, w(1) is broken (at least in sid). See the difference between > > "who" and "w" with systemd 256.7-1, i.e. before the upgrade of > > systemd that removed utmp support: > > That's because someone decided to suddenly remove an interface which has > been used for decades without any kind of transition plan or replacement. Clearly there is a replacement, because the data is there: % w 23:53:23 up 1 min, 2 users, load average: 0.06, 0.03, 0.00 USER TTY FROM LOGIN@ IDLE JCPU PCPU WHAT ch 192.168.64.1 23:53 1:24 0.00s 0.02s sshd-session: ch [priv] ch - 23:53 1:24 0.00s 0.04s /usr/lib/systemd/systemd --user % loginctl SESSION UID USER SEAT LEADER CLASS TTY IDLE SINCE 1 1000 ch - 601 user - no - 2 1000 ch - 606 manager - no - 2 sessions listed. But who: % who % Chris PS: Lack of tty in the list is IIRC some problem with openssh not passing the TTY to PAM, but this is a separate thing.
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Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2025 20:08:46 +0100
From: Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN>
To: Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN>, 1080330@HIDDEN
Subject: Re: Bug#1080330: coreutils: who no longer works
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On Sun, Feb 16, 2025 at 07:29:22PM +0100, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> After some search, quoting you from
>
> https://lists.debian.org/debian-release/2024/04/msg00493.html
>
> | Subject: Y2038-safe replacements for utmp/wtmp and lastlog
> | From: Chris Hofstaedtler
> | Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2024 13:12:21 +0200
> [...]
> | you are probably aware of the time_t-64bit migration :-)
> | However, this does not magically transition all data formats to 64bit
> | times. One such instance is the set of utmp/wtmp and lastlog files.
> |
> | Thorsten Kukuk and others have been working on replacements for the
> | existing file formats and interfaces [1]; these are called wtmpdb
> | and lastlog2.
> [...]
Right, that was a bit unclear. The replacements for file-based data
are indeed wtmpdb and lastlog2, but both are optional. The current
state ("utmp") is inside logind.
Chris
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
Full text available.Received: (at 73928) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 Feb 2025 00:01:03 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Feb 16 19:01:03 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:39212 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tjoZL-0000aS-9p for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 19:01:03 -0500 Received: from stravinsky.debian.org ([2001:41b8:202:deb::311:108]:45964) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <mstone@HIDDEN>) id 1tjoZI-0000ZZ-Fj for 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 19:01:01 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=debian.org; s=smtpauto.stravinsky; h=X-Debian-User:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version: References:Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To:From:Date:Reply-To: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description; bh=Q51JTDFUfIay79sZ9UYWsAaHsR07wiEngTQJ4GeYPz4=; b=RtxQ44jS41beuycrYRCPFaLaUX UIyyvK8MHnZMGTENIHfku+ZkxJyRp7pFOU0sRPURXonF7KiXfikRC/GnYvRPU4gcBzVwzMKdgj/NQ TtaYWHSkESqMX+OthcNoymcADHynbw7Ds/X1cDzKmmXaebAfR185wizEklOGzPH1f+Wi6Uem2vf/g 4TDkNjtcH2MnMxR1euNXgBcm601E/LQ5TQFMGpw5d3GMen4afiPMtm9OVZuGbfdiuiH6+U0B2uXHa Ogpx/OcAqeGOUpFg9clEa76Ih1NRqNzEZwD03QR0i/ur3sEjM16mCjEVT16FtpZwLBhtu4Oi1bsHQ X45LjOdQ==; Received: from authenticated user by stravinsky.debian.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_X25519__RSA_PSS_RSAE_SHA256__AES_256_GCM:256) (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from <mstone@HIDDEN>) id 1tjoZF-00BaMy-Oe; Mon, 17 Feb 2025 00:00:57 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by osgiliath.mathom.us (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8EB36E665; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 19:00:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from osgiliath.mathom.us ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (osgiliath.mathom.us [127.0.0.1]) (amavis, port 10024) with LMTP id wxXFBgZqLLIQ; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 19:00:53 -0500 (EST) Received: by osgiliath.mathom.us (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 9B54B6E706; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 19:00:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2025 19:00:53 -0500 From: Michael Stone <mstone@HIDDEN> To: Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN>, 1080330@HIDDEN Subject: Re: Bug#1080330: coreutils: who no longer works Message-ID: <f180a11a-ecc1-11ef-9b6a-00163eeb5320@HIDDEN> References: <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20240920152411.GA2199@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <Z7ImqgD2EAZS5ztL@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20250216180513.GC154386@HIDDEN> <c94cd41a-ecae-11ef-9b6a-00163eeb5320@HIDDEN> <fuzctfnvvus3xtzxs6fx6wbbgmjebzmr2mwlz7kcy57dcwxxxo@cwp6jtilg3ew> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20250216232803.GE154386@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20250216232803.GE154386@HIDDEN> X-Pgp-Fingerprint: 02D5 315F F11F 1861 860E 1E02 F61A ACDC FA11 FFDE X-Debian-User: mstone X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73928 Cc: 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) On Mon, Feb 17, 2025 at 12:28:03AM +0100, Vincent Lefevre wrote: >No data for xterm. Other terminals are affected too, such as >GNOME Terminal. Yes, much of the data from the old utmp is simply not there. A sane transition would deprecate utmp in one release while adding a replacement, then remove in the next--not just drop it and hope other people figure out how to cobble together a solution.
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
Full text available.Received: (at 73928) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Feb 2025 23:28:14 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Feb 16 18:28:14 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38983 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tjo3Z-0006Pc-NX for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 18:28:14 -0500 Received: from joooj.vinc17.net ([2001:4b99:1:3:216:3eff:fe20:ac98]:40500) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <vincent@HIDDEN>) id 1tjo3V-0006P3-JM for 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 18:28:10 -0500 Received: from smtp-qaa.vinc17.net (2a02-8428-1b1d-4d01-96a9-491d-7b48-ba31.rev.sfr.net [IPv6:2a02:8428:1b1d:4d01:96a9:491d:7b48:ba31]) by joooj.vinc17.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 093CC1BB; Mon, 17 Feb 2025 00:28:04 +0100 (CET) Received: by qaa.vinc17.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id B7759CA0095; Mon, 17 Feb 2025 00:28:03 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2025 00:28:03 +0100 From: Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN> To: Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: Bug#1080330: coreutils: who no longer works Message-ID: <20250216232803.GE154386@HIDDEN> References: <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <CAEsAu2O7WPJ3NsCs2H2=ypVbRiN2PwROJYOm4G9ZU1L6QNqk1A@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20240920152411.GA2199@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <Z7ImqgD2EAZS5ztL@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20250216180513.GC154386@HIDDEN> <c94cd41a-ecae-11ef-9b6a-00163eeb5320@HIDDEN> <fuzctfnvvus3xtzxs6fx6wbbgmjebzmr2mwlz7kcy57dcwxxxo@cwp6jtilg3ew> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <fuzctfnvvus3xtzxs6fx6wbbgmjebzmr2mwlz7kcy57dcwxxxo@cwp6jtilg3ew> X-Mailer-Info: https://www.vinc17.net/mutt/ User-Agent: Mutt/2.2.13+86 (bb2064ae) vl-169878 (2025-02-08) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73928 Cc: 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, 1080330@HIDDEN, Michael Stone <mstone@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) On 2025-02-16 23:56:43 +0100, Chris Hofstaedtler wrote: > * Michael Stone <mstone@HIDDEN> [250216 22:45]: > > On Sun, Feb 16, 2025 at 07:05:13PM +0100, Vincent Lefevre wrote: > > > No, w(1) is broken (at least in sid). See the difference between > > > "who" and "w" with systemd 256.7-1, i.e. before the upgrade of > > > systemd that removed utmp support: > > > > That's because someone decided to suddenly remove an interface which has > > been used for decades without any kind of transition plan or replacement. > > Clearly there is a replacement, because the data is there: > > % w > 23:53:23 up 1 min, 2 users, load average: 0.06, 0.03, 0.00 > USER TTY FROM LOGIN@ IDLE JCPU PCPU WHAT > ch 192.168.64.1 23:53 1:24 0.00s 0.02s sshd-session: ch [priv] > ch - 23:53 1:24 0.00s 0.04s /usr/lib/systemd/systemd --user No data for xterm. Other terminals are affected too, such as GNOME Terminal. > % loginctl > SESSION UID USER SEAT LEADER CLASS TTY IDLE SINCE > 1 1000 ch - 601 user - no - > 2 1000 ch - 606 manager - no - > > 2 sessions listed. On my Debian/unstable machine, I do not even get the same number of lines as with "w" when mosh is used. No such issue with "who" and old systemd with utmp enabled. > But who: > > % who > % > > Chris > > PS: Lack of tty in the list is IIRC some problem with openssh not > passing the TTY to PAM, but this is a separate thing. But with old system versions (and/or old "w" versions), such as in Debian/stable (bookworm), the tty is shown by "w": joooj:~> w 00:17:55 up 8 days, 1:40, 4 users, load average: 0.02, 0.07, 0.04 USER TTY FROM LOGIN@ IDLE JCPU PCPU WHAT vinc17 pts/0 2a02:8428:1b1d:4 Wed20 1.00s 4.22s 0.03s w vinc17 pts/4 mosh- 17:29 6:48m 0.97s 0.97s -zsh vinc17 pts/5 mosh- Tue19 5days 0.33s 0.33s -zsh vinc17 pts/6 mosh- Fri23 2days 0.37s 16.97s mosh-server new -- Vincent Lefèvre <vincent@HIDDEN> - Web: <https://www.vinc17.net/> 100% accessible validated (X)HTML - Blog: <https://www.vinc17.net/blog/> Work: CR INRIA - computer arithmetic / Pascaline project (LIP, ENS-Lyon)
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
Full text available.Received: (at 73928) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Feb 2025 22:52:19 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Feb 16 17:52:19 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38739 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tjnUo-0003eO-S0 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 17:52:19 -0500 Received: from mail.cs.ucla.edu ([131.179.128.66]:38570) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eggert@HIDDEN>) id 1tjnUl-0003dj-2x for 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 17:52:17 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 063703C00D403; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 14:52:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavis, port 10032) with ESMTP id fSGpUgrKUJs1; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 14:52:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7EA6E3C00D404; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 14:52:07 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 mail.cs.ucla.edu 7EA6E3C00D404 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cs.ucla.edu; s=9D0B346E-2AEB-11ED-9476-E14B719DCE6C; t=1739746327; bh=bjR2cKZnVhYyQMrN/BJehOBkhxnC5sr71ulb57iazsg=; h=Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:To:From; b=CKoI/bzQe+vZPViX4FOnfnM0vMsqK+H3QV6lUBaUJqqMK7yzID1BCqMCGXZNU5YfF SPzSbRYQ3RoPXOW28CH0CscfOdrttvo3RYXRTwBzxsDJcLPkmd1wmWp1CaWY+m8nJK VaOr9yP4rlkBcxNfI8fhN2SAGrxx6Qxaegv5mIP6UhfWnNWsCqyL+YRXND+Wes262I sC/IOATPbmYwqJCoRkhP0C/GnS7vwTEAn/xFsA1qyfv9aZitN/0mS8+3AR/wQv8jCH sYPOQqINN6PAohzzTGWIJvKHN9x0PxvkrhBGi3xDPoRRcJ+8pdnBOfKg25a0im0nz5 5IwP1xg6Ta/0Q== X-Virus-Scanned: amavis at mail.cs.ucla.edu Received: from mail.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavis, port 10026) with ESMTP id 5cvi7_YdOQS3; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 14:52:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.254.12] (unknown [47.147.225.25]) by mail.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 59A523C00D403; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 14:52:07 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <36612a40-147b-446c-801e-ab86aceebbcb@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2025 14:52:07 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: bug#73928: Bug#1080330: coreutils: who no longer works To: Michael Stone <mstone@HIDDEN> References: <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <CAEsAu2O7WPJ3NsCs2H2=ypVbRiN2PwROJYOm4G9ZU1L6QNqk1A@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20240920152411.GA2199@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <Z7ImqgD2EAZS5ztL@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20250216180513.GC154386@HIDDEN> <c94cd41a-ecae-11ef-9b6a-00163eeb5320@HIDDEN> Content-Language: en-US From: Paul Eggert <eggert@HIDDEN> Organization: UCLA Computer Science Department In-Reply-To: <c94cd41a-ecae-11ef-9b6a-00163eeb5320@HIDDEN> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73928 Cc: Thorsten Kukuk <kukuk@HIDDEN>, 1080330@HIDDEN, Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN>, Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN>, 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) At this point I confess I don't know what changes would be needed for GNU 'who'. I see a difference of opinion as to whether 'w' works. There seem to be multiple mechanisms in play (utmp, wtmp, wtmpdb, lastlog2, logind, maybe others?) and I don't know when to use which, or even how to use them except for the traditional utmp/wtmp files. Perhaps whoever has changed the longstanding API (is that Thorsten Kukuk, or someone else? anyway I'll cc Thorsten) can chime in with a proposed patch to bleeding-edge GNU coreutils. This would probably mean a patch to Gnulib's readutmp module, which already is supposed to work with systemd's new utmp interfaces but I guess some people are reporting problems with it? (This is unclear.) For what it's worth, I briefly looked at <https://build.opensuse.org/package/show/openSUSE%3AFactory/coreutils> and didn't see a patch there. So perhaps the problem is already addressed in bleeding-edge Coreutils? Without some actionable advice from experts in this area, I don't see this portability issue being fixed any time soon. For now, I've merged the following GNU Coreutils bug reports as they all seem to be the same topic. https://bugs.gnu.org/73928 https://bugs.gnu.org/76346 https://bugs.gnu.org/76347
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
Full text available.Paul Eggert <eggert@HIDDEN>
to control <at> debbugs.gnu.org.
Full text available.Received: (at 73928) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Feb 2025 21:45:39 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Feb 16 16:45:39 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38337 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tjmSI-0003nH-OO for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 16:45:39 -0500 Received: from stravinsky.debian.org ([2001:41b8:202:deb::311:108]:37318) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <mstone@HIDDEN>) id 1tjmSF-0003mw-Qp for 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 16:45:36 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=debian.org; s=smtpauto.stravinsky; h=X-Debian-User:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version: References:Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To:From:Date:Reply-To: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description; bh=qu2fMJi5Lf8ZUZO/7MSw5oqmAziVVJdeNz8W1/Viss0=; b=SatN9ig6NcXECF9HVi8s6bEOYy 7Aq7PIEaMbNMCRUXdOc+NjibiU/u0HFkAfYLSfQWFS3fm4TrRi7DtcagIhIw/jU1g0aFIGwUE/097 PberKtHuC/ioviC9v+u/MZf7/CkQIkqC4L2Uzpa6ACzSfR7A2dJCiWxoWzDNHxsgmUyg3WDEW3Nf7 kHWWtT1O4tT7P4ZXD9Rl1t0z6rEN+VIw+0WlCd4HfLDGXbLqYa8X2jxJ7fQR9SWYfhurC9eWdiCXJ sDzJ0U7vGvtfZjb2dV91IcfR9ld8dtdlzKemzQBOJG+zQelHW5wXqtYb+RoojnR6fAoYed5uOzlbF HB3fnhWA==; Received: from authenticated user by stravinsky.debian.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_X25519__RSA_PSS_RSAE_SHA256__AES_256_GCM:256) (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from <mstone@HIDDEN>) id 1tjmSD-00BVI0-MB; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 21:45:34 +0000 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by osgiliath.mathom.us (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A7FD6E6F2; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 16:45:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from osgiliath.mathom.us ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (osgiliath.mathom.us [127.0.0.1]) (amavis, port 10024) with LMTP id kFjglTkoDnw8; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 16:45:29 -0500 (EST) Received: by osgiliath.mathom.us (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 29B246E706; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 16:45:29 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2025 16:45:29 -0500 From: Michael Stone <mstone@HIDDEN> To: Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN>, 1080330@HIDDEN Subject: Re: Bug#1080330: coreutils: who no longer works Message-ID: <c94cd41a-ecae-11ef-9b6a-00163eeb5320@HIDDEN> References: <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <CAEsAu2O7WPJ3NsCs2H2=ypVbRiN2PwROJYOm4G9ZU1L6QNqk1A@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20240920152411.GA2199@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <Z7ImqgD2EAZS5ztL@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20250216180513.GC154386@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20250216180513.GC154386@HIDDEN> X-Pgp-Fingerprint: 02D5 315F F11F 1861 860E 1E02 F61A ACDC FA11 FFDE X-Debian-User: mstone X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73928 Cc: 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) On Sun, Feb 16, 2025 at 07:05:13PM +0100, Vincent Lefevre wrote: >No, w(1) is broken (at least in sid). See the difference between >"who" and "w" with systemd 256.7-1, i.e. before the upgrade of >systemd that removed utmp support: That's because someone decided to suddenly remove an interface which has been used for decades without any kind of transition plan or replacement. This isn't a bug "who" can fix.
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
Full text available.Received: (at 73928) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Feb 2025 18:29:28 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Feb 16 13:29:28 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37235 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tjjOS-0005C3-3D for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 13:29:28 -0500 Received: from joooj.vinc17.net ([2001:4b99:1:3:216:3eff:fe20:ac98]:37272) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <vincent@HIDDEN>) id 1tjjOP-0005Bn-Jd for 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 13:29:26 -0500 Received: from smtp-qaa.vinc17.net (2a02-8428-1b1d-4d01-96a9-491d-7b48-ba31.rev.sfr.net [IPv6:2a02:8428:1b1d:4d01:96a9:491d:7b48:ba31]) by joooj.vinc17.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id B0CD493; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 19:29:23 +0100 (CET) Received: by qaa.vinc17.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id E5332CA00AD; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 19:29:22 +0100 (CET) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2025 19:29:22 +0100 From: Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN> To: Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN>, 1080330@HIDDEN Subject: Re: Bug#1080330: coreutils: who no longer works Message-ID: <20250216182922.GD154386@HIDDEN> References: <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <CAEsAu2O7WPJ3NsCs2H2=ypVbRiN2PwROJYOm4G9ZU1L6QNqk1A@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20240920152411.GA2199@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <Z7ImqgD2EAZS5ztL@HIDDEN> <20250216180513.GC154386@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <20250216180513.GC154386@HIDDEN> X-Mailer-Info: https://www.vinc17.net/mutt/ User-Agent: Mutt/2.2.13+86 (bb2064ae) vl-169878 (2025-02-08) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73928 Cc: 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) On 2025-02-16 19:05:13 +0100, Vincent Lefevre wrote: > On 2025-02-16 18:55:54 +0100, Chris Hofstaedtler wrote: > > Control: retitle -1 coreutils: "who" needs to ask seat manager > > > > On Fri, Sep 20, 2024 at 05:24:11PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote: > > > Control: retitle -1 coreutils: "who" should support wtmpdb (y2038) > > > > This is mistaken. wtmpdb is a history database. who(1) wants current > > sessions, and they are being tracked by logind. > > It had been said that wtmpdb was meant to replace utmp, but perhaps > this was wrong. After some search, quoting you from https://lists.debian.org/debian-release/2024/04/msg00493.html | Subject: Y2038-safe replacements for utmp/wtmp and lastlog | From: Chris Hofstaedtler | Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2024 13:12:21 +0200 [...] | you are probably aware of the time_t-64bit migration :-) | However, this does not magically transition all data formats to 64bit | times. One such instance is the set of utmp/wtmp and lastlog files. | | Thorsten Kukuk and others have been working on replacements for the | existing file formats and interfaces [1]; these are called wtmpdb | and lastlog2. [...] -- Vincent Lefèvre <vincent@HIDDEN> - Web: <https://www.vinc17.net/> 100% accessible validated (X)HTML - Blog: <https://www.vinc17.net/blog/> Work: CR INRIA - computer arithmetic / Pascaline project (LIP, ENS-Lyon)
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
Full text available.Received: (at 73928) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Feb 2025 18:17:53 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Feb 16 13:17:53 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37170 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tjjDE-0004IP-Ru for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 13:17:53 -0500 Received: from stravinsky.debian.org ([2001:41b8:202:deb::311:108]:38378) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <zeha@HIDDEN>) id 1tjis1-0007y5-NG for 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 12:55:58 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=debian.org; s=smtpauto.stravinsky; h=X-Debian-User:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version: References:Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To:From:Date:Reply-To: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description; bh=VExZ9B5ulV+OQOhmKOiLdLnc/UKVtM07Nr03dhqz3Z8=; b=vrnNZbh1ffZ7sufV7kNpIajGx4 jmFzQTaIAf5ltpMHkMpNli56eu16rjweYHv4wDER0nTPSG7tO5j2txfdKZKKkSBc84Qg/oklZwMsA PzZQaq9nE4KfWStnnGvETyitH9coYvoePBTwMHE/pyhr7DSi16zV0KoXgvcbPVXh5C9C5y8ZN4zfI ffaWvnLqVRs3EWbSq6t8czSDt9o0ZMq1ThpbtXhVKbUsovCB1rna71AktQ8M5Emp4vvQuiq2Ozrxx fk+6MsvBvAGLwCU8R14KhFIFoJzKqcF0MHun64w44snUZIljAaLAQPqRkU8N+R3iaQ5bobTrHySPw rHtPdgPg==; Received: from authenticated user by stravinsky.debian.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_SECP256R1__RSA_PSS_RSAE_SHA256__AES_256_GCM:256) (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from <zeha@HIDDEN>) id 1tjis0-00BMy3-21; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 17:55:56 +0000 Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2025 18:55:54 +0100 From: Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN> To: 1080330@HIDDEN Subject: Re: Bug#1080330: coreutils: who no longer works Message-ID: <Z7ImqgD2EAZS5ztL@HIDDEN> References: <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <CAEsAu2O7WPJ3NsCs2H2=ypVbRiN2PwROJYOm4G9ZU1L6QNqk1A@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20240920152411.GA2199@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20240920152411.GA2199@HIDDEN> X-Debian-User: zeha X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73928 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sun, 16 Feb 2025 13:17:50 -0500 Cc: 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Control: retitle -1 coreutils: "who" needs to ask seat manager On Fri, Sep 20, 2024 at 05:24:11PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote: > Control: retitle -1 coreutils: "who" should support wtmpdb (y2038) This is mistaken. wtmpdb is a history database. who(1) wants current sessions, and they are being tracked by logind. w(1) has a working implementation. Chris
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
Full text available.Received: (at 73928) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Feb 2025 18:05:22 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Feb 16 13:05:22 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37106 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tjj17-0003Lj-P9 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 13:05:22 -0500 Received: from joooj.vinc17.net ([2001:4b99:1:3:216:3eff:fe20:ac98]:39034) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <vincent@HIDDEN>) id 1tjj15-0003LH-3l for 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 13:05:20 -0500 Received: from smtp-qaa.vinc17.net (135.197.67.86.rev.sfr.net [86.67.197.135]) by joooj.vinc17.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 1936193; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 19:05:14 +0100 (CET) Received: by qaa.vinc17.org (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 9C921CA00AD; Sun, 16 Feb 2025 19:05:13 +0100 (CET) Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2025 19:05:13 +0100 From: Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN> To: Chris Hofstaedtler <zeha@HIDDEN>, 1080330@HIDDEN Subject: Re: Bug#1080330: coreutils: who no longer works Message-ID: <20250216180513.GC154386@HIDDEN> References: <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <CAEsAu2O7WPJ3NsCs2H2=ypVbRiN2PwROJYOm4G9ZU1L6QNqk1A@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <20240920152411.GA2199@HIDDEN> <20240902110759.GA3557783@HIDDEN> <Z7ImqgD2EAZS5ztL@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <Z7ImqgD2EAZS5ztL@HIDDEN> X-Mailer-Info: https://www.vinc17.net/mutt/ User-Agent: Mutt/2.2.13+86 (bb2064ae) vl-169878 (2025-02-08) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 73928 Cc: 73928 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) On 2025-02-16 18:55:54 +0100, Chris Hofstaedtler wrote: > Control: retitle -1 coreutils: "who" needs to ask seat manager > > On Fri, Sep 20, 2024 at 05:24:11PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote: > > Control: retitle -1 coreutils: "who" should support wtmpdb (y2038) > > This is mistaken. wtmpdb is a history database. who(1) wants current > sessions, and they are being tracked by logind. It had been said that wtmpdb was meant to replace utmp, but perhaps this was wrong. > w(1) has a working implementation. No, w(1) is broken (at least in sid). See the difference between "who" and "w" with systemd 256.7-1, i.e. before the upgrade of systemd that removed utmp support: qaa:~> who vinc17 tty7 2025-02-12 20:22 (:0) vinc17 pts/0 2025-02-12 20:22 (:0) vinc17 pts/3 2025-02-12 20:22 (:0) vinc17 pts/2 2025-02-12 20:22 (:0) vinc17 pts/1 2025-02-12 20:22 (:0) vinc17 pts/5 2025-02-13 19:59 (155.133.131.76) vinc17 pts/6 2025-02-14 03:44 (:0) vinc17 pts/4 2025-02-12 20:22 (:0) vinc17 pts/7 2025-02-12 20:22 (:0) vinc17 pts/8 2025-02-12 20:22 (:0) vinc17 pts/10 2025-02-12 20:35 (:0) vinc17 pts/11 2025-02-12 20:35 (:0) vinc17 pts/12 2025-02-13 01:40 (:0) vinc17 pts/13 2025-02-13 02:31 (:0) vinc17 pts/14 2025-02-16 18:57 (:pts/9:S.0) vinc17 pts/15 2025-02-16 18:59 (:0) vinc17 pts/16 2025-02-16 18:57 (:pts/9:S.1) vinc17 pts/17 2025-02-15 02:10 (:0) qaa:~> w 19:00:52 up 3 days, 22:39, 3 users, load average: 0.58, 0.76, 0.77 USER TTY FROM LOGIN@ IDLE JCPU PCPU WHAT vinc17 155.133.131.76 Thu19 23:10m 0.00s 0.02s sshd-session: vinc17 [priv] vinc17 - Wed20 23:10m 0.00s 0.01s lightdm --session-child 15 22 vinc17 - Wed20 23:10m 0.00s 0.20s /usr/lib/systemd/systemd --user -- Vincent Lefèvre <vincent@HIDDEN> - Web: <https://www.vinc17.net/> 100% accessible validated (X)HTML - Blog: <https://www.vinc17.net/blog/> Work: CR INRIA - computer arithmetic / Pascaline project (LIP, ENS-Lyon)
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
Full text available.Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 21 Oct 2024 16:49:03 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 21 12:49:02 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53116 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1t2vaY-0002hE-J2 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 12:49:02 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:36212) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eggert@HIDDEN>) id 1t2vaV-0002go-O1 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 12:49:01 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eggert@HIDDEN>) id 1t2va0-0003Gb-Be for bug-coreutils@HIDDEN; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 12:48:29 -0400 Received: from mail.cs.ucla.edu ([131.179.128.66]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eggert@HIDDEN>) id 1t2vZy-0007LB-9g for bug-coreutils@HIDDEN; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 12:48:27 -0400 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 278BA3C013279; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 09:48:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavis, port 10032) with ESMTP id 4L0g1fm6p7wx; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 09:48:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC3FC3C00FB18; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 09:48:23 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.10.3 mail.cs.ucla.edu DC3FC3C00FB18 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=cs.ucla.edu; s=9D0B346E-2AEB-11ED-9476-E14B719DCE6C; t=1729529303; bh=/W3qxufPZkpEXp9OOHJrMm4esRHQBXo5yGBQh2FKqSY=; h=Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:To:From; b=OjbaWtwHMHqceDgk1lj1q1ocXvTBG6IP3PmLZzG4QJHES1DHNBOYHm2CuERBQ79L7 tZl/Rdy+P2Pzuo6I2puZBYZpaVWQ8YpxpJqqmsdVwDT/nVY4N3Y6hN9bktM9+/pHJZ U+o3mx3i2xrUSVb1AD8q0BC/XlDIXUeCsClT3E6n37MvNSORnva0qe3GkClZRY461R 8DwSOk7Gpsi6wxJsSv+sTud+aQH+zppT5BHHELH/5COjgkXaV8OkN/SusKBkge9H6k OHwXKrlJnmiuj/9RUbK4jfL39InMtvBYZ1PUTFDrkPxX8h49t7AoU77sP+jdpt8RWw tQcb3iuEfXB3g== X-Virus-Scanned: amavis at mail.cs.ucla.edu Received: from mail.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavis, port 10026) with ESMTP id 4GVbTS2XMgdu; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 09:48:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.254.12] (unknown [47.150.137.250]) by mail.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id C3A5B3C013279; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 09:48:23 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <9bc4bc73-2085-4489-b6e3-5a7def80c473@HIDDEN> Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2024 09:48:23 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: bug#73928: "who" should support wtmpdb To: Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN>, bug-coreutils@HIDDEN References: <20241021111543.GA3909@HIDDEN> Content-Language: en-US From: Paul Eggert <eggert@HIDDEN> Organization: UCLA Computer Science Department In-Reply-To: <20241021111543.GA3909@HIDDEN> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Received-SPF: pass client-ip=131.179.128.66; envelope-from=eggert@HIDDEN; helo=mail.cs.ucla.edu X-Spam_score_int: -19 X-Spam_score: -2.0 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.0 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_CERTIFIED_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_RPBL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) On 2024-10-21 04:15, Vincent Lefevre wrote: > The "who" utility should support wtmpdb. How would that be done?
bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
Full text available.Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 21 Oct 2024 11:16:42 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Oct 21 07:16:42 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50421 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1t2qOw-0003Wq-6n for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 07:16:42 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:39452) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <vincent@HIDDEN>) id 1t2qOt-0003Wg-57 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 07:16:40 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <vincent@HIDDEN>) id 1t2qOK-0007ru-EF for bug-coreutils@HIDDEN; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 07:16:06 -0400 Received: from cventin.lip.ens-lyon.fr ([140.77.13.17]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <vincent@HIDDEN>) id 1t2qOD-0007M1-Bb for bug-coreutils@HIDDEN; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 07:16:00 -0400 Received: from vlefevre by cventin.lip.ens-lyon.fr with local (Exim 4.98) (envelope-from <vincent@HIDDEN>) id 1t2qNz-000000001E2-21IV; Mon, 21 Oct 2024 13:15:43 +0200 Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2024 13:15:43 +0200 From: Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN> To: bug-coreutils@HIDDEN Subject: "who" should support wtmpdb Message-ID: <20241021111543.GA3909@HIDDEN> Mail-Followup-To: Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN>, bug-coreutils@HIDDEN MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Mailer-Info: https://www.vinc17.net/mutt/ User-Agent: Mutt/2.2.13+77 (9dc98409) vl-169878 (2024-06-20) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=140.77.13.17; envelope-from=vincent@HIDDEN; helo=cventin.lip.ens-lyon.fr X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_CERTIFIED_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_RPBL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) The "who" utility should support wtmpdb. It no longer works when utmp support is disabled by systemd (the /var/run/utmp file no longer exists). -- Vincent Lefèvre <vincent@HIDDEN> - Web: <https://www.vinc17.net/> 100% accessible validated (X)HTML - Blog: <https://www.vinc17.net/blog/> Work: CR INRIA - computer arithmetic / AriC project (LIP, ENS-Lyon)
Vincent Lefevre <vincent@HIDDEN>:bug-coreutils@HIDDEN.
Full text available.bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:bug#73928; Package coreutils.
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