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From: "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>
To: "Eli Zaretskii" <eliz@HIDDEN>
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Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 16:55:02 +0000
Message-ID: <m8lvms9p.0884cf38-343b-44d8-b196-1dfdafbd1fa5@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS
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--3c9d9fb861c02bb979161f15838db18030b66387e39fc2b5e65b48348be7
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On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 9:39 AM, Eli Zaretskii < eliz@HIDDEN > wrote:
>=20
>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> Date: Sun , 23 Mar 2025 16:03:17 +0000
>> Cc: gerd. moellmann@ gmail. com ( gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN ) , alan@ idi=
ocy.
>> org ( alan@HIDDEN ) , 77039@ debbugs. gnu. org ( 77039@HIDDEN=
rg
>> ) From: "Aaron Jensen" < aaronjensen@ gmail. com ( aaronjensen@HIDDEN=
)
>> >
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 3:37 AM, Eli Zaretskii < eliz@ gnu. org (
>> eliz@HIDDEN ) > wrote:
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> Cc: gerd. moellmann@ gmail. com ( gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN ) , alan@ idi=
ocy.
>> org ( alan@HIDDEN ) , 77039@ debbugs. gnu. org ( 77039@HIDDEN=
rg
>> ) Date: Sun , 23 Mar 2025 12:13:10 +0200
>> From: Eli Zaretskii < eliz@ gnu. org ( eliz@HIDDEN ) >
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> So in summary, I don't see anything abnormal here. If we want to keep th=
e
>> only-current-line-changed optimization in redisplay_internal, someone wi=
ll
>> have to come up with a smarter test for when line numbers are shown. I
>> think the underlying problem is that when the line number of the current
>> line becomes large enough to require more columns for line-number displa=
y,
>> we must redraw the entire window to avoid the problem with shifting or
>> line number described in https:/ / debbugs. gnu. org/ cgi/ bugreport. cg=
i?bug=3D54091#5
>> ( https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D54091#5 ).
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> To clarify: this should not cause any flickering, AFAIU, because the
>> comparison of glyphs in subroutines of update_frame is supposed to find
>> that everything on the glass is already up-to-date and there's no need t=
o
>> draw anything. So flickering, which happens because portions of the wind=
ow
>> are actually redrawn on the glass, should not happen in this case.
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> Right, I don't observe any flickering.
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> OK, so I think we are good.
>=20
>=20
>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> Am I correct that it is only comparing the glyphs on the current line?
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> No, I think in the case we were analyzing it compares the glyphs of the
> entire window, or its large parts.
>=20
>=20
>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> If
>> so, that doesn't seem like a huge problem, even though it is (in most
>> cases?) technically extra work.
>>=20
>>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> For this extra work to be spared, someone has to devise a method of
> examining the buffer and the window before actually redrawing it, and
> deciding that no update is needed, and do it cheaply enough to yield net
> savings.
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> You should keep in mind the basic problem redisplay needs to solve. It
> doesn't react to each and every change in the buffers and other structure=
s
> that affect display. Instead, it is called when Emacs thinks it's good
> time to maybe redisplay, and it needs to decide, just by looking at the
> buffers as they are at that time, what has changed since last redisplay
> and how those changes might affect the windows on display. When the first
> phase of redisplay cannot safely exclude the need for redrawing a window
> or some of its parts, it produces the
> "desired" glyph matrices for those parts, which describe how those parts
> _should_ look, and leaves it to the second phase to decide what, if
> anything, should actually be redrawn on the glass, by comparing the
> desired matrix with the current matrix (which describes what _is_ on the
> glass). Thus, this second phase, which is where the comparison of the
> glyphs happens, is the "last line of defense" against unnecessary
> redrawing, which would otherwise cause flickering and is relatively
> expensive.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> It is in many cases impossible to know whether a particular change in
> buffer text will require large portions of a window to be redrawn, withou=
t
> actually doing the layout work that produces the desired matrix. That's
> because the layout of glyphs is a complex process with many tricky rules,
> which all but preclude fast and cheap decisions like that except in very
> simple cases. For example, insertion of a single character in a middle of
> bidirectional text can completely change the way characters are laid out
> on the glass. So the simple cases are detected and handled by "redisplay
> optimizations" of the first phase of redisplay, and the rest is left to
> the second phase, which prevents unnecessary redraws based on glyph
> comparison.
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
Thank you for the detailed response. Unless I'm missing something, it sound=
s like we can close this. I don't know if the FIXME comment is worth removi=
ng (or perhaps replaced with an explanation, rather than an expressed inten=
t to correct).
Aside from that, with the flicker gone, I'm happy. Thank you all.
Aaron
--3c9d9fb861c02bb979161f15838db18030b66387e39fc2b5e65b48348be7
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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<html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla=
ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); =
color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.6);">On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 9:39 AM, Eli Zaretskii =
</span><span dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" tar=
get=3D"_blank" class=3D"">eliz@HIDDEN</a>></span><span style=3D"backgro=
und-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.6);"> wrote:</span></di=
v></div></div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div class=
=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8=
ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extra">=
<div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D"">
Date: <span class=3D"sh-date" data-date-isostring=3D"2025-03-30">Sun</span>=
, <span class=3D"sh-date" data-date-isostring=3D"2025-03-23">23 Mar 2025</s=
pan> 16:03:17 +0000
<br/>
Cc: <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:gerd.mo=
ellmann@HIDDEN" class=3D"">gerd.<wbr/>moellmann@<wbr/>gmail.<wbr/>com</a=
>, <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:alan@idi=
ocy.org" class=3D"">alan@<wbr/>idiocy.<wbr/>org</a>, <a target=3D"_blank" r=
el=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org" class=3D""=
>77039@<wbr/>debbugs.<wbr/>gnu.<wbr/>org</a>
From: "Aaron Jensen" <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noref=
errer" href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" class=3D"">aaronjensen@<wbr/>g=
mail.<wbr/>com</a>>
</p><p class=3D"">
On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 3:37 AM, Eli Zaretskii <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=
=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" class=3D"">eliz@<wbr/=
>gnu.<wbr/>org</a>> wrote:
<br/></p><p class=3D"">
Cc: <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:gerd.mo=
ellmann@HIDDEN" class=3D"">gerd.<wbr/>moellmann@<wbr/>gmail.<wbr/>com</a=
>, <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:alan@idi=
ocy.org" class=3D"">alan@<wbr/>idiocy.<wbr/>org</a>, <a target=3D"_blank" r=
el=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org" class=3D""=
>77039@<wbr/>debbugs.<wbr/>gnu.<wbr/>org</a> Date: <span class=3D"sh-date" =
data-date-isostring=3D"2025-03-30">Sun</span>, <span class=3D"sh-date" data=
-date-isostring=3D"2025-03-23">23 Mar 2025</span>
12:13:10 +0200=20
<br/>
From: Eli Zaretskii <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" hr=
ef=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" class=3D"">eliz@<wbr/>gnu.<wbr/>org</a>>=20
</p><p class=3D"">
So in summary, I don't see anything abnormal here. If we want to keep t=
he
only-current-line-changed optimization in redisplay_internal, someone will =
have to come up with a
smarter test for when line numbers are shown. I think the underlying proble=
m is that when the line
number of the current line becomes large enough to require more columns for=
line-number
display, we must redraw the entire window to avoid the problem with shiftin=
g or line number
described in <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"https=
://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D54091#5" class=3D"">https:/<wbr/=
>/<wbr/>debbugs.<wbr/>gnu.<wbr/>org/<wbr/>cgi/<wbr/>bugreport.<wbr/>cgi?bug=
=3D54091#5</a> .=20
<br/></p><p class=3D"">
To clarify: this should not cause any flickering, AFAIU, because the compar=
ison of glyphs in
subroutines of update_frame is supposed to find that everything on the glas=
s is already up-to-date and
there's no need to draw anything. So flickering, which happens because =
portions of the window are
actually redrawn on the glass, should not happen in this case.
<br/></p><p class=3D"">
Right, I don't observe any flickering.
<br/></p></blockquote><p class=3D"">
OK, so I think we are good.
<br/></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D"">
Am I correct that it is only comparing the glyphs on the current
line?
<br/></p></blockquote><p class=3D"">
No, I think in the case we were analyzing it compares the glyphs of
the entire window, or its large parts.
<br/></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D"">
If
<br/>
so, that doesn't seem like a huge problem, even though it is (in most c=
ases?) technically extra work.
</p></blockquote><p class=3D"">
For this extra work to be spared, someone has to devise a method of
examining the buffer and the window before actually redrawing it, and
deciding that no update is needed, and do it cheaply enough to yield
net savings.
<br/></p><p class=3D"">
You should keep in mind the basic problem redisplay needs to solve.
It doesn't react to each and every change in the buffers and other
structures that affect display. Instead, it is called when Emacs
thinks it's good time to maybe redisplay, and it needs to decide, just
by looking at the buffers as they are at that time, what has changed
since last redisplay and how those changes might affect the windows on
display. When the first phase of redisplay cannot safely exclude the
need for redrawing a window or some of its parts, it produces the
<br/>
"desired" glyph matrices for those parts, which describe how those
parts _should_ look, and leaves it to the second phase to decide what,
if anything, should actually be redrawn on the glass, by comparing the
desired matrix with the current matrix (which describes what _is_ on
the glass). Thus, this second phase, which is where the comparison of
the glyphs happens, is the "last line of defense" against unnecessa=
ry
redrawing, which would otherwise cause flickering and is relatively
expensive.
</p><p class=3D"">
It is in many cases impossible to know whether a particular change in
buffer text will require large portions of a window to be redrawn,
without actually doing the layout work that produces the desired
matrix. That's because the layout of glyphs is a complex process with
many tricky rules, which all but preclude fast and cheap decisions
like that except in very simple cases. For example, insertion of a
single character in a middle of bidirectional text can completely
change the way characters are laid out on the glass. So the simple
cases are detected and handled by "redisplay optimizations" of the
first phase of redisplay, and the rest is left to the second phase,
which prevents unnecessary redraws based on glyph comparison.<br/></p></div=
></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div><div><div><br/></div><div>Thank=
you for the detailed response. Unless I'm missing something, it sounds=
like we can close this. I don't know if the FIXME comment is worth rem=
oving (or perhaps replaced with an explanation, rather than an expressed in=
tent to correct).<br/></div><div><br/></div><div>Aside from that, with the =
flicker gone, I'm happy. Thank you all.</div><div><br/></div><div>Aaron=
</div></div></div><div><div style=3D"display: none; border: 0px; width: 0px=
; height: 0px; overflow: hidden; visibility: hidden;"><img src=3D"https://r=
.superhuman.com/xzOi_QuBmpQBzn8U14S6NCh08Wq9_7ck1vPoV3VvHopKlI0tjRj9iP1WqVS=
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gFyBblmxp7vKdFmDy-QtWUelfN22RmuaWthIX8x1r1Kl--Wj8.gif" alt=3D" " width=3D"1=
" height=3D"0" style=3D"display: none; border: 0px; width: 0px; height: 0px=
; overflow: hidden; visibility: hidden;"/><!-- =
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bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Mar 2025 16:39:35 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Mar 23 12:39:35 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52232 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1twOMH-0007UQ-8X for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 12:39:35 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:52824) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twOM7-0007TT-8f for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 12:39:24 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twOM0-0004VC-Hz; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 12:39:16 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=37Nqp+Rvh1dtOXTv5jxKW3eWLpgOV8gdFPaQ5gFQ7A8=; b=U78zwWXRVYUC 2wCD0T1mveoWeMSbk9INBZ0izKeFUQ63YbAQqmHFCokuZ7XvQHSOumBR5lSJ5O5wolSeWuyywx9mL ce0CEiZ5wg5uR06Id5QKewMXOviUAZQFPz6yTbQFVwpxwqwrb6IW749iZilCu8qJYvj85JuzTsoA3 j5vwRTlkz3Ea4FVeYJIvUy1C36jm9Xi4+3IajOIK9bucxP46o/tImwM5FL7Wm2WciDrGpWpOlS0GP klnOkpTKs8X24gz6VSVBbCfPUfBY277sQuDjJQAgvJOpq9z/FEO2Ur6ENumbIwzRby/ZpQVLU2TUW gSZdEiE+ZihOL9n6H+64MA==; Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 18:39:04 +0200 Message-Id: <86iknzg0rb.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <m8ltt0l6.2106518a-a140-4350-9e8b-b78494dbe5b9@HIDDEN> (aaronjensen@HIDDEN) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2pli86bpq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN> <86h63kgosu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m8ld3dcb.8b537957-ea8c-495c-b453-e455877fc66f@HIDDEN> <867c4ggimh.fsf@HIDDEN> <865xk0ghi2.fsf@HIDDEN> <m8ltt0l6.2106518a-a140-4350-9e8b-b78494dbe5b9@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 16:03:17 +0000 > Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > From: "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > > On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 3:37 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: > > Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 > 12:13:10 +0200 > From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> > > So in summary, I don't see anything abnormal here. If we want to keep the > only-current-line-changed optimization in redisplay_internal, someone will have to come up with a > smarter test for when line numbers are shown. I think the underlying problem is that when the line > number of the current line becomes large enough to require more columns for line-number > display, we must redraw the entire window to avoid the problem with shifting or line number > described in https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=54091#5 . > > To clarify: this should not cause any flickering, AFAIU, because the comparison of glyphs in > subroutines of update_frame is supposed to find that everything on the glass is already up-to-date and > there's no need to draw anything. So flickering, which happens because portions of the window are > actually redrawn on the glass, should not happen in this case. > > Right, I don't observe any flickering. OK, so I think we are good. > Am I correct that it is only comparing the glyphs on the current > line? No, I think in the case we were analyzing it compares the glyphs of the entire window, or its large parts. > If > so, that doesn't seem like a huge problem, even though it is (in most cases?) technically extra work. For this extra work to be spared, someone has to devise a method of examining the buffer and the window before actually redrawing it, and deciding that no update is needed, and do it cheaply enough to yield net savings. You should keep in mind the basic problem redisplay needs to solve. It doesn't react to each and every change in the buffers and other structures that affect display. Instead, it is called when Emacs thinks it's good time to maybe redisplay, and it needs to decide, just by looking at the buffers as they are at that time, what has changed since last redisplay and how those changes might affect the windows on display. When the first phase of redisplay cannot safely exclude the need for redrawing a window or some of its parts, it produces the "desired" glyph matrices for those parts, which describe how those parts _should_ look, and leaves it to the second phase to decide what, if anything, should actually be redrawn on the glass, by comparing the desired matrix with the current matrix (which describes what _is_ on the glass). Thus, this second phase, which is where the comparison of the glyphs happens, is the "last line of defense" against unnecessary redrawing, which would otherwise cause flickering and is relatively expensive. It is in many cases impossible to know whether a particular change in buffer text will require large portions of a window to be redrawn, without actually doing the layout work that produces the desired matrix. That's because the layout of glyphs is a complex process with many tricky rules, which all but preclude fast and cheap decisions like that except in very simple cases. For example, insertion of a single character in a middle of bidirectional text can completely change the way characters are laid out on the glass. So the simple cases are detected and handled by "redisplay optimizations" of the first phase of redisplay, and the rest is left to the second phase, which prevents unnecessary redraws based on glyph comparison.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS
To: "Eli Zaretskii" <eliz@HIDDEN>
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From: "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>
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--b0edb5ce973d2cf5a034e424170f035c6250d17cf21efb6bd5b4f5a59258
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On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 3:37 AM, Eli Zaretskii < eliz@HIDDEN > wrote:
>=20
>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> Cc: gerd. moellmann@ gmail. com ( gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN ) , alan@ idi=
ocy.
>> org ( alan@HIDDEN ) , 77039@ debbugs. gnu. org ( 77039@HIDDEN=
rg
>> ) Date: Sun , 23 Mar 2025 12:13:10 +0200
>> From: Eli Zaretskii < eliz@ gnu. org ( eliz@HIDDEN ) >
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> So in summary, I don't see anything abnormal here. If we want to keep th=
e
>> only-current-line-changed optimization in redisplay_internal, someone wi=
ll
>> have to come up with a smarter test for when line numbers are shown. I
>> think the underlying problem is that when the line number of the current
>> line becomes large enough to require more columns for line-number displa=
y,
>> we must redraw the entire window to avoid the problem with shifting or
>> line number described in https:/ / debbugs. gnu. org/ cgi/ bugreport. cg=
i?bug=3D54091#5
>> ( https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D54091#5 ).
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> To clarify: this should not cause any flickering, AFAIU, because the
> comparison of glyphs in subroutines of update_frame is supposed to find
> that everything on the glass is already up-to-date and there's no need to
> draw anything. So flickering, which happens because portions of the windo=
w
> are actually redrawn on the glass, should not happen in this case.
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
Right, I don't observe any flickering. Am I correct that it is only compari=
ng the glyphs on the current line? If so, that doesn't seem like a huge pro=
blem, even though it is (in most cases?) technically extra work.
Aaron
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<html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla=
ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); =
color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.6);">On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 3:37 AM, Eli Zaretskii =
</span><span dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" tar=
get=3D"_blank" class=3D"">eliz@HIDDEN</a>></span><span style=3D"backgro=
und-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.6);"> wrote:</span></di=
v></div></div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div class=
=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8=
ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extra">=
<div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D"">
Cc: <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:gerd.mo=
ellmann@HIDDEN" class=3D"">gerd.<wbr/>moellmann@<wbr/>gmail.<wbr/>com</a=
>, <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:alan@idi=
ocy.org" class=3D"">alan@<wbr/>idiocy.<wbr/>org</a>, <a target=3D"_blank" r=
el=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org" class=3D""=
>77039@<wbr/>debbugs.<wbr/>gnu.<wbr/>org</a>
Date: <span class=3D"sh-date" data-date-isostring=3D"2025-03-30">Sun</span>=
, <span class=3D"sh-date" data-date-isostring=3D"2025-03-23">23 Mar 2025</s=
pan> 12:13:10 +0200
<br/>
From: Eli Zaretskii <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" hr=
ef=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" class=3D"">eliz@<wbr/>gnu.<wbr/>org</a>>
</p><p class=3D"">
So in summary, I don't see anything abnormal here. If we want to keep
the only-current-line-changed optimization in redisplay_internal,
someone will have to come up with a smarter test for when line numbers
are shown. I think the underlying problem is that when the line
number of the current line becomes large enough to require more
columns for line-number display, we must redraw the entire window to
avoid the problem with shifting or line number described in
<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"https://debbugs.gn=
u.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D54091#5" class=3D"">https:/<wbr/>/<wbr/>debbu=
gs.<wbr/>gnu.<wbr/>org/<wbr/>cgi/<wbr/>bugreport.<wbr/>cgi?bug=3D54091#5</a=
> .
<br/></p></blockquote><p class=3D"">
To clarify: this should not cause any flickering, AFAIU, because the
comparison of glyphs in subroutines of update_frame is supposed to
find that everything on the glass is already up-to-date and there's no
need to draw anything. So flickering, which happens because portions
of the window are actually redrawn on the glass, should not happen in
this case.<br/></p></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div><div><d=
iv><br/></div><div>Right, I don't observe any flickering. Am I correct =
that it is only comparing the glyphs on the current line? If so, that doesn=
't seem like a huge problem, even though it is (in most cases?) technic=
ally extra work.<br/></div><div><br/></div><div>Aaron<br/></div></div></div=
><div><div style=3D"display: none; border: 0px; width: 0px; height: 0px; ov=
erflow: hidden; visibility: hidden;"><img src=3D"https://r.superhuman.com/J=
M_lAGw36ShlYK3J7cv5aX4JM8faTxC2hBUihgjV65HABKhGa276pHDpX0NwRZA8VzQ8z4gLTnYo=
JmZXjU5x5XptOoFjfoh6e91q4bBLxVbsgDo6L6I3WYbTef7iLqeBRr69ddT_MYln9SoPDKpYXFv=
geI1ZD7DlIkBnV7Dtml4uBuH_yLlx3So.gif" alt=3D" " width=3D"1" height=3D"0" st=
yle=3D"display: none; border: 0px; width: 0px; height: 0px; overflow: hidde=
n; visibility: hidden;"/><!-- =
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--b0edb5ce973d2cf5a034e424170f035c6250d17cf21efb6bd5b4f5a59258--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Mar 2025 10:37:41 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Mar 23 06:37:41 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47888 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1twIi4-0002OF-1a for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 06:37:40 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:50662) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twIi1-0002Mc-Fy for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 06:37:38 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twIhv-0005zD-AT; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 06:37:31 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=WmeH2VbvOxNYvCgTVKuaE59vVn0i/0g1lCUb4GW11iE=; b=Opw69HEooqrS bYHFtOPnBPQxspR8mu8/KZt/XezI8/1zK6Lp7JsbnaPKjfGMz80XJFgFGOGfb8/bfAJ7R9LiuU9wn 9+U+OM9BVLFo1q5yE57QGAIHd2cMd0it+NusCos9qGE1XpNtykCpd8AvkwCzGZWyfQVf4vZcqVH3q 7CW8AWJ9BE3fnGwOd6eknjPrkVXKPi0jIHEz1I1LEo/2dfu56LuarVRKj/JmURMNtH/WpTk/n3qDQ MjBiKCe812UxQOJfvPvmuUNbGhxyRwaZXsFm8G+nSf1Tjn3BPGyCwT5GKuFoD/++bxvHj46F00G9E uf80Fu00Gd3ySMpncMPhyQ==; Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 12:37:25 +0200 Message-Id: <865xk0ghi2.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: aaronjensen@HIDDEN, gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN In-Reply-To: <867c4ggimh.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Eli Zaretskii on Sun, 23 Mar 2025 12:13:10 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2pli86bpq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN> <86h63kgosu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m8ld3dcb.8b537957-ea8c-495c-b453-e455877fc66f@HIDDEN> <867c4ggimh.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 12:13:10 +0200 > From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> > > So in summary, I don't see anything abnormal here. If we want to keep > the only-current-line-changed optimization in redisplay_internal, > someone will have to come up with a smarter test for when line numbers > are shown. I think the underlying problem is that when the line > number of the current line becomes large enough to require more > columns for line-number display, we must redraw the entire window to > avoid the problem with shifting or line number described in > https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=54091#5 . To clarify: this should not cause any flickering, AFAIU, because the comparison of glyphs in subroutines of update_frame is supposed to find that everything on the glass is already up-to-date and there's no need to draw anything. So flickering, which happens because portions of the window are actually redrawn on the glass, should not happen in this case.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 12:13:10 +0200
Message-Id: <867c4ggimh.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m8ld3dcb.8b537957-ea8c-495c-b453-e455877fc66f@HIDDEN>
(aaronjensen@HIDDEN)
Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS
References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN>
<CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN>
<m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN>
<CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN>
<m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN>
<CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN>
<864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN>
<CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN>
<m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN>
<CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN>
<867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN>
<CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN>
<86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN>
<CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN>
<86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN>
<868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN>
<86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2pli86bpq.fsf@HIDDEN>
<CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN>
<86h63kgosu.fsf@HIDDEN>
<m8ld3dcb.8b537957-ea8c-495c-b453-e455877fc66f@HIDDEN>
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> Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> From: "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>
> Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 08:16:18 +0000
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 12:59 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote:
>
> From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>
> Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 17:38:01 -0400
> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>
> It's global-display-line-numbers-mode.
>
> Repro from emacs -Q:
>
> (defun foo ()
> (Interactive)
> (global-display-line-numbers-mode)
> (term "/usr/bin/yes")
> (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*"))
>
> If you set display-line-numbers-mode to 'visual globally, does the problem go away?
>
> No, nor does disabling blink cursor mode or commenting out the lines you referenced.
>
> I'm using this, please double check I'm not doing something wrong.
>
> (defun foo ()
> (interactive)
> (blink-cursor-mode -1)
> (global-display-line-numbers-mode)
> (setq-default display-line-numbers-mode 'visual)
> (term "/usr/bin/yes")
> (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*"))
My testing indicates that setting display-line-numbers-mode to
'visual' does stop redisplay of the selected window. I did that with
a simple "M-x set-variable", not with the globalized mode.
And I did misinterpret the code in redisplay_internal: when
display-line-numbers-mode is not nil and not 'visual', we currently go
ahead with calling redisplay_window, and there I think we use the
method marked with "1" here:
/* Try to redisplay starting at same place as before.
If point has not moved off frame, accept the results. */
if (!current_matrix_up_to_date_p
/* Don't use try_window_reusing_current_matrix in this case
because a window scroll function can have changed the
buffer. */
|| !NILP (Vwindow_scroll_functions)
|| MINI_WINDOW_P (w)
|| !(used_current_matrix_p
= try_window_reusing_current_matrix (w)))
{
IF_DEBUG (debug_method_add (w, "1")); <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
clear_glyph_matrix (w->desired_matrix);
if (try_window (window, startp, TRY_WINDOW_CHECK_MARGINS) < 0)
/* -1 means we need to scroll.
0 means we need new matrices, but fonts_changed
is set in that case, so we will detect it below. */
goto try_to_scroll;
}
because try_window_reusing_current_matrix also gives up when
line-numbers are shown.
So in summary, I don't see anything abnormal here. If we want to keep
the only-current-line-changed optimization in redisplay_internal,
someone will have to come up with a smarter test for when line numbers
are shown. I think the underlying problem is that when the line
number of the current line becomes large enough to require more
columns for line-number display, we must redraw the entire window to
avoid the problem with shifting or line number described in
https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=54091#5 .
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Mar 2025 09:44:47 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Mar 23 05:44:47 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47687 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1twHss-0008UR-Hx for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 05:44:47 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:36758) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twHsq-0008Tj-0k for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 05:44:44 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twHsj-0005Ov-19; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 05:44:37 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=0MfARZpwV9DEOE6gpzc4SXW4Go4cdEP2QV/JR/rbYaM=; b=oXCK4Qw9mMrNbPshNApU qO8uM94z7JieE317MD4wBxFBi3Vb8V43VWwGIMRFvIkn9hfHzWxDkUexKzy66ZWYTLFoy5faDoBxd pIloHBEwGDFkGVQldzlsdNQ1N3KGakSbmtZSp4UsvnnH36FWeJJ+1CU9f7FGYQFMnLyGvta4I1tAU wSQRmgaXhNSw4tcFHW7tZOPZmxfauxefzheZn/7kqxXMPEycPZfWCilc7+S+Ow1MYhPnWiCsIcq8y vOYNOEwk6H0jvmeZuji3GVyw8gjgwoTKeDyJxTfaPj7JgJstDhHtcWLTyq2vhOM2gqtbu6oajCAhx CtViEH+OOijcdw==; Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 11:44:35 +0200 Message-Id: <86a59cgjy4.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <m234f4149e.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?= =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Sun, 23 Mar 2025 10:32:29 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2pli86bpq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN> <m2ldsw5oqe.fsf@HIDDEN> <86iko0gouu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f4149e.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, aaronjensen@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> > Cc: aaronjensen@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 10:32:29 +0100 > > Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: > > >> redisplay_internal has this (line numbers may differ): > >> > >> xdisp.c: > >> 17368 && (NILP (Vdisplay_line_numbers) > >> 17369 || EQ (Vdisplay_line_numbers, Qvisual)) > >> > >> This means that certain redisplay optimizations that make redisplay > >> particularly "cheap" are not tried, depending on line number display. > > > > See bug#54091. > > Thanks, but it's still an enigma for me :-). I've never used > hs-minor-mode and don't know how it is implemented. Is it the old > selective display, and something the OP did that changed it that way? No, it uses an overlay with 'invisible' property. See hs-make-overlay in hideshow.el.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b742:4600:3905:9269:3024:5d32]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-43d4fdb03e9sm80655375e9.33.2025.03.23.02.32.29 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 23 Mar 2025 02:32:30 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS In-Reply-To: <86iko0gouu.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2pli86bpq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN> <m2ldsw5oqe.fsf@HIDDEN> <86iko0gouu.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 10:32:29 +0100 Message-ID: <m234f4149e.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, aaronjensen@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: >> From: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> >> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039@HIDDEN= rg >> Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 05:56:41 +0100 >>=20 >> > Repro from emacs -Q: >> > >> > (defun foo () >> > (Interactive) >> > (global-display-line-numbers-mode) >> > (term "/usr/bin/yes") >> > (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*")) >> > >> > Aaron >>=20 >> Thanks! I think I see now what's going on. >>=20 >> redisplay_internal has this (line numbers may differ): >>=20 >> xdisp.c: >> 17368 && (NILP (Vdisplay_line_numbers) >> 17369 || EQ (Vdisplay_line_numbers, Qvisual)) >>=20 >> This means that certain redisplay optimizations that make redisplay >> particularly "cheap" are not tried, depending on line number display. > > See bug#54091. Thanks, but it's still an enigma for me :-). I've never used hs-minor-mode and don't know how it is implemented. Is it the old selective display, and something the OP did that changed it that way?
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS
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Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 10:25:34 +0100
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"Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes:
> On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 12:59 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote:
>
> From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>
> Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 17:38:01 -0400
> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>
> It's global-display-line-numbers-mode.
>
> Repro from emacs -Q:
>
> (defun foo ()
> (Interactive)
> (global-display-line-numbers-mode)
> (term "/usr/bin/yes")
> (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*"))
>
> If you set display-line-numbers-mode to 'visual globally, does the problem go away?
>
> No, nor does disabling blink cursor mode or commenting out the lines you referenced.
>
> I'm using this, please double check I'm not doing something wrong.
>
> (defun foo ()
> (interactive)
> (blink-cursor-mode -1)
> (global-display-line-numbers-mode)
> (setq-default display-line-numbers-mode 'visual)
^^^^^
Vdisplay_line_numbers = display-line-numbers. Also, I would set it before
activating the mode because setq-default doesn't change existing
buffer-local bindings.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Mar 2025 09:13:35 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Mar 23 05:13:34 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47637 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1twHOf-0003ZI-Ic for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 05:13:34 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38324) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twHOb-0003Xs-VM for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 05:13:31 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twHOT-0000zQ-0Q; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 05:13:22 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=2UgP3uRWO0d5jKKpJsTP3m1xYuUyk0KK5VhUm9Uewro=; b=ZHWL0JGhGHfH swJ58hGirGPld8HatbROjIvJ+VUjH/36GO9cdfVY8W25W5DXJDKE5wczG1TGOuUzMLcuuUgbix7Cv N+4k1jdkwE39v0QEEhSZSFPwdSaGbuKleVDnIUDuKoe5Z3qtTx7ot5G6F10oMj1WEDF4df4T6RJz9 5y5yBcKCN1uqO8sGTThw9kFJdZzBKjyRTCyHLwizl2BQmzCD8VkQ2mMU+vafdoyH4m17FSih8nRQ1 fkqpL3+eRgrsyCMwRDh5imoEJodn71V6wqgq6GOgVn3vzBLPsHstfaxLa0/mKti/BTSSyJVlaBPwS 7ZZkSVa9KCeZ4Dd2OSsTvQ==; Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 11:13:18 +0200 Message-Id: <86cye8gle9.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <m8ld3dcb.8b537957-ea8c-495c-b453-e455877fc66f@HIDDEN> (aaronjensen@HIDDEN) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2pli86bpq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN> <86h63kgosu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m8ld3dcb.8b537957-ea8c-495c-b453-e455877fc66f@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > From: "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 08:16:18 +0000 > > (defun foo () > (Interactive) > (global-display-line-numbers-mode) > (term "/usr/bin/yes") > (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*")) > > If you set display-line-numbers-mode to 'visual globally, does the problem go away? > > No, nor does disabling blink cursor mode or commenting out the lines you referenced. > > I'm using this, please double check I'm not doing something wrong. > > (defun foo () > (interactive) > (blink-cursor-mode -1) > (global-display-line-numbers-mode) > (setq-default display-line-numbers-mode 'visual) > (term "/usr/bin/yes") > (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*")) Then the conditions mention by Gerd are not the ones at play here. Or maybe I'm missing something else.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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From: "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>
Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 08:16:18 +0000
Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS
To: "Eli Zaretskii" <eliz@HIDDEN>
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--a2f394b7d253ca471594accb8a2227a436a8fd48102c9f515f33e48a0171
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On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 12:59 AM, Eli Zaretskii < eliz@HIDDEN > wrote:
>=20
>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> From: Aaron Jensen < aaronjensen@ gmail. com ( aaronjensen@HIDDEN ) >
>>=20
>> Date: Sat , 22 Mar 2025 17:38:01 -0400
>>=20
>> Cc: Eli Zaretskii < eliz@ gnu. org ( eliz@HIDDEN ) >, alan@ idiocy. org=
(
>> alan@HIDDEN ) , 77039@ debbugs. gnu. org ( 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org )
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> It's global-display-line-numbers-mode.
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> Repro from emacs -Q:
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> (defun foo ()
>>=20
>> (Interactive)
>>=20
>> (global-display-line-numbers-mode)
>>=20
>> (term "/usr/bin/yes")
>>=20
>> (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*"))
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> If you set display-line-numbers-mode to 'visual globally, does the proble=
m
> go away?
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
No, nor does disabling blink cursor mode or commenting out the lines you re=
ferenced.
I'm using this, please double check I'm not doing something wrong.
(defun foo ()
(interactive)
(blink-cursor-mode -1)
(global-display-line-numbers-mode)
(setq-default display-line-numbers-mode 'visual)
(term "/usr/bin/yes")
(switch-to-buffer "*scratch*"))
--a2f394b7d253ca471594accb8a2227a436a8fd48102c9f515f33e48a0171
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
<html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla=
ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0);"=
>On Sun, Mar 23, 2025 at 12:59 AM, Eli Zaretskii </span><span dir=3D"ltr" c=
lass=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">=
eliz@HIDDEN</a>></span><span style=3D"background-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0=
);"> wrote:</span><br/></div></div></div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><=
div class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote"=
style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><d=
iv class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"">=
<p class=3D""><br/></p><div class=3D"">From: Aaron Jensen <<a target=3D"=
_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" c=
lass=3D"">aaronjensen@<wbr/>gmail.<wbr/>com</a>> <br/></div><div class=
=3D""> Date: <span class=3D"sh-date" data-date-isostring=3D"2025-03-29">Sat=
</span>, <span class=3D"sh-date" data-date-isostring=3D"2025-03-22">22 Mar =
2025</span> 17:38:01 -0400 <br/></div><div class=3D""> Cc: Eli Zaretskii &l=
t;<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:eliz@gnu.=
org" class=3D"">eliz@<wbr/>gnu.<wbr/>org</a>>, <a target=3D"_blank" rel=
=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:alan@HIDDEN" class=3D"">alan@<w=
br/>idiocy.<wbr/>org</a>, <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" =
href=3D"mailto:77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org" class=3D"">77039@<wbr/>debbugs.<wbr/>=
gnu.<wbr/>org</a><br/></div><p><br/></p><p class=3D"">It's global-displ=
ay-line-numbers-mode. <br/></p><p class=3D"">Repro from emacs -Q: <br/></p>=
<p class=3D""><br/></p><div class=3D"">(defun foo () <br/></div><div class=
=3D""> (Interactive) <br/></div><div class=3D""> (global-display-line-numbe=
rs-mode) <br/></div><div class=3D""> (term "/usr/bin/yes") <br/></d=
iv><div class=3D""> (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*"))<br/></div><p><b=
r/></p></blockquote><p class=3D"">If you set display-line-numbers-mode to &=
#39;visual globally, does the
problem go away?<br/></p></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div><=
div><div><br/></div><div>No, nor does disabling blink cursor mode or commen=
ting out the lines you referenced.<br/></div><div><br/></div><div>I'm u=
sing this, please double check I'm not doing something wrong.</div><div=
><br/></div></div><div>(defun foo ()<br/></div><div>=C2=A0 (interactive)<br=
/></div><div>=C2=A0 (blink-cursor-mode -1)<br/></div><div>=C2=A0 (global-di=
splay-line-numbers-mode)<br/></div><div>=C2=A0 (setq-default display-line-n=
umbers-mode 'visual)<br/></div><div>=C2=A0(term "/usr/bin/yes")=
<br/></div><div>(switch-to-buffer "*scratch*"))<br/></div><div><div=
><br/></div></div><div><br/></div></div><div><div style=3D"display: none; b=
order: 0px; width: 0px; height: 0px; overflow: hidden; visibility: hidden;"=
><img src=3D"https://r.superhuman.com/1ez-yn8D7_zNBBKdcQoa3XGmNSeq0dNzN6HmO=
VE_MyefRLvXeRbrEMMqr5gKsnz0-bAk7UlsGN9q6FzJBh_uFi_5lKQ348jU1BegurVZjPHg1MHS=
GXW7pniXneKa6MUG_0_kSn6CQAT8pElvcEqB338tPMU9DKUazKOD3se6wZ1V8fdZe1NDyH4.gif=
" alt=3D" " width=3D"1" height=3D"0" style=3D"display: none; border: 0px; w=
idth: 0px; height: 0px; overflow: hidden; visibility: hidden;"/><!-- =
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ml>
--a2f394b7d253ca471594accb8a2227a436a8fd48102c9f515f33e48a0171--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Mar 2025 08:04:20 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Mar 23 04:04:19 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47517 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1twGJe-0001Aq-4a for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 04:04:19 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:44586) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twGJb-00019X-3v for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 04:04:16 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twGJU-0006SB-Oq; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 04:04:09 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=Oq4ItLWGuWfCbPYxojg1Nm8SeHPSCBscwhLTOrx7BFc=; b=nVHw3jXLy7T7627TjYG5 6GqzdB73qG5peu9XMO4bjl5cKl3ZT1EkccAcBEmH8pwrpfzvNYMUUL/dBoSDISd25PV8SJwS/CkRY 1aMD+f58rMZ8jA688ULID10G+LpJt+hZ/FJaWYFHE0h0JreKlqxxdYSrKQbvkXQh+RhUZDreiOD2X z2c0D03qRJso1q9S5fVN7vl3qBvKk4NZTc3C3EohhGVZmjbV2pCD+5M2qJ8E+818fIQXV82YVwot1 wQI2a2m3q/D55VsFrgVfA6IywFX3IfcIs6VmqR++1j8Gh+v6vpFxaU9J1HleWhQFTA99FfJKBgE7T C8AGS+3lJL4+Bg==; Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 10:04:04 +0200 Message-Id: <86frj4goln.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <m2cye85mo9.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?= =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Sun, 23 Mar 2025 06:41:10 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2pli86bpq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN> <m2ldsw5oqe.fsf@HIDDEN> <m8l6cwfn.3eb66048-f864-4d4d-a193-7be2e1b84a0e@HIDDEN> <m2cye85mo9.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, aaronjensen@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> > Cc: "Eli Zaretskii" <eliz@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 06:41:10 +0100 > > "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > > > Thanks! I think I see now what's going on. > > > > redisplay_internal has this (line numbers may differ): > > > > xdisp.c: > > 17368 && (NILP (Vdisplay_line_numbers) 17369 || EQ (Vdisplay_line_numbers, Qvisual)) > > > > This means that certain redisplay optimizations that make redisplay particularly "cheap" are not > > tried, depending on line number display. > > > > Instead the more expensive redisplay methods are used that consider whole windows or parts of them > > and so on. Or, in other words, line number display can make redisplay less of a nop. > > > > So, with line numbers, hidden buffer with process -> wait_reading_process_output -> > > redisplay_internal -> update_window (or similar) -> ... -> row_equal_p -> the equal macros > > > > My vterm buffers do not have line numbers, so it sounds like it's > > considering the line number status of the currently visible window, > > does that sound right? > > Yes, it's the value in current_buffer. Don't see ATM where that is set, > but it's normally the buffer of the selected window. Maybe that's > implicitly the case if consider_all_windows is false. Of course, it's from the current buffer. But we forgot the effect of blink-cursor-mode, which forces a (minor) redisplay cycle every 0.5 sec, and requires to at least redraw the character under the cursor. So turning off blink-cursor-mode should perhaps prevent the problem. Does it? > > And it looks like there's a FIXME comment right above it: > > > > ``` > > /* FIXME: The following condition is only needed when > > significant parts of the buffer are hidden (e.g., under > > hs-minor-mode), but there doesn't seem to be a simple way of > > detecting that, so we always disable the one-line redisplay > > optimizations whenever display-line-numbers-mode is turned on > > in the buffer. */ > > Yeah, I've seen that, but I couldn't figure out what circumstance > prevents using the optimizations in this case, specifically when line > numbers are displayed. An enigma :-). Not an enigma: "git annotate" points to a certain bug which was the trigger for the addition of this condition.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Mar 2025 07:59:56 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Mar 23 03:59:56 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47506 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1twGFQ-0000Ve-2a for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 03:59:56 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:53632) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twGFN-0000V9-LS for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 03:59:54 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twGFH-0005a4-DI; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 03:59:47 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=z7med0wUM5ln3iWfYSEwB8z0ou6zQoUv1UjVqv7ICY4=; b=SqtD3Xh4XOFs I+d0ZYyRd3rx4DPdIQb4Fwhw60upi8UHbbs5SuJuAzKwlCVSslSZm+eyAMFZLaZ4PZ5y/ojfOE10w hvfXDJr8teqAtaZnNIFWFSEx9qrAqEVHyXQHf5ODZWPolE8hstk0Q80VWA23wd3kF8JnbnhahhTdE NznixNbwM01RBhsGRp33DSa4IeUJ6uiGCpWfJ9etG/hX+4Gce/j8a1Ox23p9JTHYDUccbqZ7nooiM vpkmgTB/SHNkUWoCt2tW8XijRAhSgMjveTHAZzIFlSJaEtqa+vUp3mwEhcZCZxFqjZsqlhGwoIUk+ He5gTILT2A6Ja1Q4obOKwQ==; Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 09:59:45 +0200 Message-Id: <86h63kgosu.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN> (message from Aaron Jensen on Sat, 22 Mar 2025 17:38:01 -0400) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2pli86bpq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 17:38:01 -0400 > Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > It's global-display-line-numbers-mode. > > Repro from emacs -Q: > > (defun foo () > (Interactive) > (global-display-line-numbers-mode) > (term "/usr/bin/yes") > (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*")) If you set display-line-numbers-mode to 'visual globally, does the problem go away?
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Mar 2025 07:58:49 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Mar 23 03:58:49 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47498 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1twGEJ-0000Me-DH for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 03:58:48 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:47654) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twGEG-0000L8-4L for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 03:58:45 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1twGE8-0005Qk-L4; Sun, 23 Mar 2025 03:58:36 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=1e/Ox+wGFxDDp6ulJfjdajN+iFUYd+eaFUyqdNOUgSQ=; b=Ka1Ld3cKEiC2sm5WmFGR bO01fqIvhJ//G1pteCy86adFLbSM6KU4XwtnppU5y2xS1hLbmMWkRsWDWFnN7JFIiNIKKHgrlIsmg Em1JlyWyG3zlUYeaIskSxc3pwixHlG1zuzK0niLttq7KDAPa2xs5xtxqsq4bK5NOBbvmE5aiWs4Br UnMb68GuLLGgYoSOEaCq4AEB0+GI9e9+ulb4wx5rk997BoEBK1HGaBLUCYQweKw4F5W8kh/FGGc0D qT0MqG0qsTK+hUndV3mguWMOaCRPbJ5l1OePhYy7MIz6KE6/GHBKH79QM/Pvcebzbm9ulwlUZORtE NPKMHnTYrbXvJg==; Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 09:58:33 +0200 Message-Id: <86iko0gouu.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <m2ldsw5oqe.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?= =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Sun, 23 Mar 2025 05:56:41 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2pli86bpq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN> <m2ldsw5oqe.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, aaronjensen@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> > Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 05:56:41 +0100 > > > Repro from emacs -Q: > > > > (defun foo () > > (Interactive) > > (global-display-line-numbers-mode) > > (term "/usr/bin/yes") > > (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*")) > > > > Aaron > > Thanks! I think I see now what's going on. > > redisplay_internal has this (line numbers may differ): > > xdisp.c: > 17368 && (NILP (Vdisplay_line_numbers) > 17369 || EQ (Vdisplay_line_numbers, Qvisual)) > > This means that certain redisplay optimizations that make redisplay > particularly "cheap" are not tried, depending on line number display. See bug#54091. > Instead the more expensive redisplay methods are used that consider > whole windows or parts of them and so on. Or, in other words, line > number display can make redisplay less of a nop. Yes, and there's little wonder it's so: certain changes in the buffer and point position could potentially have effect on line numbers of lines that are not involved in the change, so more thorough redisplay is needed.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b742:4600:3905:9269:3024:5d32]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-43d4fd18505sm75578015e9.11.2025.03.22.22.41.10 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sat, 22 Mar 2025 22:41:12 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS In-Reply-To: <m8l6cwfn.3eb66048-f864-4d4d-a193-7be2e1b84a0e@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2pli86bpq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN> <m2ldsw5oqe.fsf@HIDDEN> <m8l6cwfn.3eb66048-f864-4d4d-a193-7be2e1b84a0e@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 06:41:10 +0100 Message-ID: <m2cye85mo9.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > Thanks! I think I see now what's going on. > > redisplay_internal has this (line numbers may differ): > > xdisp.c: > 17368 && (NILP (Vdisplay_line_numbers) 17369 || EQ (Vdisplay_line_numbers, Qvisual)) > > This means that certain redisplay optimizations that make redisplay particularly "cheap" are not > tried, depending on line number display. > > Instead the more expensive redisplay methods are used that consider whole windows or parts of them > and so on. Or, in other words, line number display can make redisplay less of a nop. > > So, with line numbers, hidden buffer with process -> wait_reading_process_output -> > redisplay_internal -> update_window (or similar) -> ... -> row_equal_p -> the equal macros > > My vterm buffers do not have line numbers, so it sounds like it's > considering the line number status of the currently visible window, > does that sound right? Yes, it's the value in current_buffer. Don't see ATM where that is set, but it's normally the buffer of the selected window. Maybe that's implicitly the case if consider_all_windows is false. > > And it looks like there's a FIXME comment right above it: > > ``` > /* FIXME: The following condition is only needed when > significant parts of the buffer are hidden (e.g., under > hs-minor-mode), but there doesn't seem to be a simple way of > detecting that, so we always disable the one-line redisplay > optimizations whenever display-line-numbers-mode is turned on > in the buffer. */ Yeah, I've seen that, but I couldn't figure out what circumstance prevents using the optimizations in this case, specifically when line numbers are displayed. An enigma :-).
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS
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<864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN>
<CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN>
<m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN>
<CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN>
<867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN>
<CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN>
<86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN>
<CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN>
<86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN>
<868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN>
<86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2pli86bpq.fsf@HIDDEN>
<CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN>
<m2ldsw5oqe.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: "Aaron Jensen" <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>
Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 05:10:22 +0000
Message-ID: <m8l6cwfn.3eb66048-f864-4d4d-a193-7be2e1b84a0e@HIDDEN>
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boundary=f93b6979c84482a2b342c6985170c1939f6a863419507da5b75bee70cd33
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--f93b6979c84482a2b342c6985170c1939f6a863419507da5b75bee70cd33
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
On Sat, Mar 22 , 2025 at 9:56=E2=80=AFPM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann < gerd.moellma=
nn@HIDDEN > wrote:
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Aaron Jensen < aaronjensen@HIDDEN > writes:
>=20
>=20
>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> Right, and I agree. I'm trying to find a way to explain the difference
>> that Aaron sees with and
>> without his config. Otherwise I have no idea how to proceed with this.
>>=20
>>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> >
>=20
>=20
>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> It's global-display-line-numbers-mode.
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> >
>=20
>=20
>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> Repro from emacs -Q:
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> >
>=20
>=20
>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> (defun foo ()
>> (Interactive)
>> (global-display-line-numbers-mode)
>> (term "/usr/bin/yes")
>> (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*"))
>>=20
>>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> >
>=20
>=20
>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> Aaron
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Thanks! I think I see now what's going on.
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> redisplay_internal has this (line numbers may differ):
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> xdisp.c:
> 17368 && (NILP (Vdisplay_line_numbers) 17369 || EQ (Vdisplay_line_numbers=
,
> Qvisual))
>=20
>=20
>=20
> This means that certain redisplay optimizations that make redisplay
> particularly "cheap" are not tried, depending on line number display.
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Instead the more expensive redisplay methods are used that consider whole
> windows or parts of them and so on. Or, in other words, line number
> display can make redisplay less of a nop.
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> So, with line numbers, hidden buffer with process ->
> wait_reading_process_output -> redisplay_internal -> update_window (or
> similar) -> ... -> row_equal_p -> the equal macros
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
My vterm=C2=A0buffers do not have line numbers, so it sounds like it's cons=
idering the line number status of the currently visible window, does that s=
ound right?
And it looks like there's a FIXME comment right above it:
```
/* FIXME: The following condition is only needed when
significant parts of the buffer are hidden (e.g., under
hs-minor-mode), but there doesn't seem to be a simple way of
detecting that, so we always disable the one-line redisplay
optimizations whenever display-line-numbers-mode is turned on
in the buffer.=C2=A0 */
Thanks,
Aaron
--f93b6979c84482a2b342c6985170c1939f6a863419507da5b75bee70cd33
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
<html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla=
ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span class=3D"sh-date" style=3D"color: rgba(0, 0, =
0, 0.6);">On Sat, Mar 22</span><span style=3D"background-color: rgba(0, 0, =
0, 0); color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0.6);">, 2025 at 9:56=E2=80=AFPM, Gerd M=C3=B6l=
lmann
<</span><a href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN" target=3D"_b=
lank" class=3D"" style=3D"background-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0);">gerd.moellma=
nn@HIDDEN</a><span style=3D"background-color: rgba(0, 0, 0, 0); color: r=
gba(0, 0, 0, 0.6);">>
wrote:</span><br/></div></div></div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content=
"><div class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><di=
v>
<br/></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0.=
8ex; border-left: 1px #ccc solid; padding-left: 1ex;"><div>
<br/></div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><p class=3D"">Aaron Jens=
en <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:aaro=
njensen@HIDDEN">aaronjensen@HIDDEN</a>> writes:
<br/></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D"">
Right, and I agree. I'm trying to find a way to explain the difference=
that Aaron sees with and
<br/>
without his config. Otherwise I have no idea how to proceed with this.
</p></blockquote><p class=3D"">
>
<br/></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D"">
It's global-display-line-numbers-mode.
<br/></p></blockquote><p class=3D"">
>
<br/></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D"">
Repro from emacs -Q:
<br/></p></blockquote><p class=3D"">
>
<br/></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D"">
(defun foo ()
<br/>
(Interactive)
<br/>
(global-display-line-numbers-mode)
<br/>
(term "/usr/bin/yes")
<br/>
(switch-to-buffer "*scratch*"))
</p></blockquote><p class=3D"">
>
<br/></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D"">
Aaron
<br/></p></blockquote><p class=3D"">
Thanks! I think I see now what's going on.
<br/></p><p class=3D"">
redisplay_internal has this (line numbers may differ):
<br/></p><p class=3D"">
xdisp.c:
<br/>
17368 && (NILP (Vdisplay_line_numbers)
17369 || EQ (Vdisplay_line_numbers, Qvisual))
</p><p class=3D"">
This means that certain redisplay optimizations that make redisplay
particularly "cheap" are not tried, depending on line number displa=
y.
<br/></p><p class=3D"">
Instead the more expensive redisplay methods are used that consider
whole windows or parts of them and so on. Or, in other words, line
number display can make redisplay less of a nop.
<br/></p><p class=3D"">
So, with line numbers, hidden buffer with process ->
wait_reading_process_output -> redisplay_internal -> update_window (o=
r
similar) -> ... -> row_equal_p -> the equal macros<br/></p></div><=
/div></blockquote></div></div></div></div></div><div><div><br/></div><div>M=
y vterm=C2=A0buffers do not have line numbers, so it sounds like it's c=
onsidering the line number status of the currently visible window, does tha=
t sound right?<br/></div><div><br/></div><div>And it looks like there's=
a FIXME comment right above it:<br/></div><div><br/></div></div><div>```<b=
r/></div><div>=C2=A0=C2=A0 /* FIXME: The following condition is only needed=
when<br/></div><div>significant parts of the buffer are hidden (e.g., unde=
r<br/></div><div>hs-minor-mode), but there doesn't seem to be a simple =
way of<br/></div><div>detecting that, so we always disable the one-line red=
isplay<br/></div><div>optimizations whenever display-line-numbers-mode is t=
urned on<br/></div><div>in the buffer.=C2=A0 */<br/></div><div><br/></div><=
div><div>Thanks,<br/></div></div><div><br/></div><div>Aaron</div></div><div=
><div style=3D"display: none; border: 0px; width: 0px; height: 0px; overflo=
w: hidden; visibility: hidden;"><img src=3D"https://r.superhuman.com/EPgor1=
akLEJImqcg14uvBsPK5Mdy1gdK0rqxwJuBwA4P_Esefr4fn-HbtfrzAraSOOGu9eF7Pq73a6ME5=
m28d3NkTg-hT6zGacpx-ysHxlSnsfGf3IS-1ygWvUzPM-HBUmxJmV6HHoz1fHu6DWvrBHrFmTX0=
lR_t0wdRRGOCyHiY3q6nLLTuBB4.gif" alt=3D" " width=3D"1" height=3D"0" style=
=3D"display: none; border: 0px; width: 0px; height: 0px; overflow: hidden; =
visibility: hidden;"/><!-- =
=
=
=
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--></div></div></div></body></html>
--f93b6979c84482a2b342c6985170c1939f6a863419507da5b75bee70cd33--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b742:4600:3905:9269:3024:5d32]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-3997f9e6445sm6813984f8f.71.2025.03.22.21.56.41 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sat, 22 Mar 2025 21:56:42 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2pli86bpq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zQJ245W=K9F8L=yxXD2b+tQA3uA-Ksc=2UbArVpQ4Eng@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2025 05:56:41 +0100 Message-ID: <m2ldsw5oqe.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > Right, and I agree. I'm trying to find a way to explain the difference that Aaron sees with and > without his config. Otherwise I have no idea how to proceed with this. > > It's global-display-line-numbers-mode. > > Repro from emacs -Q: > > (defun foo () > (Interactive) > (global-display-line-numbers-mode) > (term "/usr/bin/yes") > (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*")) > > Aaron Thanks! I think I see now what's going on. redisplay_internal has this (line numbers may differ): xdisp.c: 17368 && (NILP (Vdisplay_line_numbers) 17369 || EQ (Vdisplay_line_numbers, Qvisual)) This means that certain redisplay optimizations that make redisplay particularly "cheap" are not tried, depending on line number display. Instead the more expensive redisplay methods are used that consider whole windows or parts of them and so on. Or, in other words, line number display can make redisplay less of a nop. So, with line numbers, hidden buffer with process -> wait_reading_process_output -> redisplay_internal -> update_window (or similar) -> ... -> row_equal_p -> the equal macros
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Flickering on macOS To: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000831f010630f52f85" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --000000000000831f010630f52f85 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, Mar 22, 2025 at 1:40 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN= om> wrote: > Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: > > From: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> Cc: aaronjensen@gmail= .com, > alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 21:20:09 > +0100 > > Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: > > I'd also look for something doing things to mode-line-format first, maybe= . > But I also have no real idea what that is. > > Given that the glyph rows in question have their mode_line_p flag reset, > is that still a possibility? > > Hm, probably not. > > But could this make a difference? > > dispnew.c: > 5261 static int > 5262 scrolling_window (struct window *w, int tab_line_p) > > Why would scrolling_window be called at all if we never call update_windo= w > for buffers that are not shown in any window? > > AFAIU, the scenario is that the sub-process is inserting text into a > buffer that isn't shown in any window on display. In this case, redisplay > is supposed to conclude that no window needs to be redrawn, and if so, > update_window will not be called for any window. Right? > > Right, and I agree. I'm trying to find a way to explain the difference > that Aaron sees with and without his config. Otherwise I have no idea how > to proceed with this. > It's global-display-line-numbers-mode. Repro from emacs -Q: (defun foo () (Interactive) (global-display-line-numbers-mode) (term "/usr/bin/yes") (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*")) Aaron --000000000000831f010630f52f85 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla= ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color= :rgba(0,0,0,0.6)">On Sat, Mar 22, 2025 at 1:40 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann </spa= n><span dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN= om" target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN</a>></span><sp= an style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)"> wrote:</= span></div></div></div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><di= v class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0= 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_= extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><p class=3D"">Eli Zaretskii <<a target= =3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" class= =3D"">eliz@<wbr>gnu.<wbr>org</a>> writes: <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> From: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferre= r" href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN" class=3D"">gerd.<wbr>moellmann@= <wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>> Cc: <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:aaronje= nsen@HIDDEN" class=3D"">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>, <a target= =3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:alan@HIDDEN" cla= ss=3D"">alan@<wbr>idiocy.<wbr>org</a>, <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopene= r noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org" class=3D"">77039@<wbr>d= ebbugs.<wbr>gnu.<wbr>org</a> Date: <span class=3D"sh-date">Sat</span>, <span class=3D"sh-date">22 Mar 20= 25</span> 21:20:09 +0100 <br></p><p class=3D""> Eli Zaretskii <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"= mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" class=3D"">eliz@<wbr>gnu.<wbr>org</a>> writes: <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> I'd also look for something doing things to mode-line-format first, maybe. But I also have no real idea what that is. <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> Given that the glyph rows in question have their mode_line_p flag reset, is that still a possibility? <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> Hm, probably not. <br></p><p class=3D""> But could this make a difference? <br></p><p class=3D""> dispnew.c: <br> 5261 static int <br> 5262 scrolling_window (struct window *w, int tab_line_p) </p></blockquote><p class=3D""> Why would scrolling_window be called at all if we never call update_window for buffers that are not shown in any window? <br></p><p class=3D""> AFAIU, the scenario is that the sub-process is inserting text into a buffer that isn't shown in any window on display. In this case, redisplay is supposed to conclude that no window needs to be redrawn, and if so, update_window will not be called for any window. Right? <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> Right, and I agree. I'm trying to find a way to explain the difference that Aaron sees with and without his config. Otherwise I have no idea how to proceed with this.<br></p></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div= ></div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><br></div></div><div class=3D""><div= class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""= >It's global-display-line-numbers-mode.<br></div><div class=3D""><div c= lass=3D""><br></div></div><div class=3D"">Repro from emacs -Q:<br></div><di= v class=3D""><div class=3D""><br></div></div><div class=3D""><span class=3D= "" style=3D"font-weight:400;text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-c= olor:initial">(defun foo ()</span><br></div><div class=3D""><span class=3D"= " style=3D"font-weight:400;text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-co= lor:initial">(Interactive)</span><br></div><div class=3D"">(<span class=3D"= ">global</span>-display-line-numbers-mode)<br></div><div class=3D""><span c= lass=3D"" style=3D"font-weight:400;text-decoration-style:initial;text-decor= ation-color:initial">(term "/usr/bin/yes")</span><br></div><div c= lass=3D""><span class=3D"" style=3D"font-weight:400;text-decoration-style:i= nitial;text-decoration-color:initial">(switch-to-buffer "*scratch*&quo= t;))</span><br></div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><br></div></div><div c= lass=3D""><span class=3D"">Aaron</span><br></div></div></div></div></div><d= iv><br></div></div></div><div></div></div></body></html> --000000000000831f010630f52f85--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b714:5700:7102:57a0:fb2f:1f7a]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-3997f9955fbsm5901187f8f.5.2025.03.22.13.40.17 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sat, 22 Mar 2025 13:40:18 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS In-Reply-To: <86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 21:40:17 +0100 Message-ID: <m2pli86bpq.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, aaronjensen@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: >> From: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> >> Cc: aaronjensen@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 21:20:09 +0100 >>=20 >> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: >>=20 >> >> I'd also look for something doing things to mode-line-format first, >> >> maybe. But I also have no real idea what that is. >> > >> > Given that the glyph rows in question have their mode_line_p flag >> > reset, is that still a possibility? >>=20 >> Hm, probably not. >>=20 >> But could this make a difference? >>=20 >>=20 >> dispnew.c: >> 5261 static int >> 5262 scrolling_window (struct window *w, int tab_line_p) > > Why would scrolling_window be called at all if we never call > update_window for buffers that are not shown in any window? > > AFAIU, the scenario is that the sub-process is inserting text into a > buffer that isn't shown in any window on display. In this case, > redisplay is supposed to conclude that no window needs to be redrawn, > and if so, update_window will not be called for any window. Right? Right, and I agree. I'm trying to find a way to explain the difference that Aaron sees with and without his config. Otherwise I have no idea how to proceed with this.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Mar 2025 20:32:40 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sat Mar 22 16:32:40 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45851 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tw5WK-0000Dp-4Q for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Mar 2025 16:32:40 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:40700) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tw5UH-0008Oe-Sq for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Mar 2025 16:30:34 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tw5UB-0006XG-7u; Sat, 22 Mar 2025 16:30:27 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=wqZ/Bb2ORXTbCcsah5DOMs6xlHf2GZgh+CwkFyQMVEo=; b=YGuRHwewDuKnDe4QgEoo P1uYN20gW7GHTOgPHsevQT2PTsslFXWdE0+IGnoPvCg1vzfPbXVpkSfFFHfP3QtdmkWUhTLRBRtOv 8KEmSNKzww1FQ+MEjeVmhzjmE/O1HqdeJ5hfvg3m0FrpaC+1ssLV0xC9QCSvd7kbkvpG6x9sGw24+ 0+S61X06oeh7tthWtttap5p3yVDE5cN/PIg0KoefyeblckyoVEV7cemZshk4muvZhzgZgQCZxRF9C lJUpecCpcJA8Qnh1QZcQZp7PdRwRaPwTnjCbUsvbORo9PkvwmKzcu2c3sxwq7uorMRvDsbTXAQPRl 5UkgA2ut1NaluA==; Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 22:30:21 +0200 Message-Id: <86v7s0hkpu.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?= =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Sat, 22 Mar 2025 21:20:09 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, aaronjensen@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> > Cc: aaronjensen@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 21:20:09 +0100 > > Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: > > >> I'd also look for something doing things to mode-line-format first, > >> maybe. But I also have no real idea what that is. > > > > Given that the glyph rows in question have their mode_line_p flag > > reset, is that still a possibility? > > Hm, probably not. > > But could this make a difference? > > > dispnew.c: > 5261 static int > 5262 scrolling_window (struct window *w, int tab_line_p) Why would scrolling_window be called at all if we never call update_window for buffers that are not shown in any window? AFAIU, the scenario is that the sub-process is inserting text into a buffer that isn't shown in any window on display. In this case, redisplay is supposed to conclude that no window needs to be redrawn, and if so, update_window will not be called for any window. Right?
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS
In-Reply-To: <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN>
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<m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN>
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Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 21:20:09 +0100
Message-ID: <m2wmcg6cna.fsf@HIDDEN>
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Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
>> From: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
>> Cc: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN,
>> 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 18:43:58 +0100
>>=20
>> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
>>=20
>> > I'm afraid you will need to come up with a reproduction recipe for
>> > this, so that we could investigate what causes this. Maybe it's a bug
>> > or maybe I'm missing something.
>>=20
>> If it's something in Aaron's config, maybe he could bisect this.
>
> I hope so.
>
>> I'd also look for something doing things to mode-line-format first,
>> maybe. But I also have no real idea what that is.
>
> Given that the glyph rows in question have their mode_line_p flag
> reset, is that still a possibility?
Hm, probably not.
But could this make a difference?
dispnew.c:
5261 static int
5262 scrolling_window (struct window *w, int tab_line_p)
5263 {
5264 struct glyph_matrix *desired_matrix =3D w->desired_matrix;
5265 struct glyph_matrix *current_matrix =3D w->current_matrix;
5266 int yb =3D window_text_bottom_y (w);
5267 ptrdiff_t i;
5268 int j, first_old, first_new, last_old, last_new;
5269 int nruns, run_idx;
5270 ptrdiff_t n;
5271 struct row_entry *entry;
5272 struct redisplay_interface *rif =3D FRAME_RIF (XFRAME (WINDOW_FRAME=
(w)));
5273=20
5274 /* Skip over rows equal at the start. */
5275 for (i =3D tab_line_p; i < current_matrix->nrows - 1; ++i)
^^^^^^^^^^
(That can apparently be 0, 1, or 2. Bad name.)
5276 {
5277 struct glyph_row *d =3D MATRIX_ROW (desired_matrix, i);
5278 struct glyph_row *c =3D MATRIX_ROW (current_matrix, i);
5279=20
5280 /* If there is a row with a stipple currently on the glass, give
5281 up. Stipples look different depending on where on the
5282 display they are drawn, so scrolling the display will produce
5283 incorrect results. */
5284=20
5285 if (c->stipple_p)
5286 return 0;
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
What's that stipple thing? Aaron, could that stipple be different
with an without your config?
=20
5287=20
5288 if (c->enabled_p
5289 && d->enabled_p
5290 && !d->redraw_fringe_bitmaps_p
Or something in the fringes?
5291 && c->y =3D=3D d->y
5292 && MATRIX_ROW_BOTTOM_Y (c) <=3D yb
5293 && MATRIX_ROW_BOTTOM_Y (d) <=3D yb
5294 && row_equal_p (c, d, 1))
But that's clueless guessing.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Mar 2025 19:22:37 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sat Mar 22 15:22:37 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45524 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tw4QX-0007Gw-0S for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Mar 2025 15:22:37 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38070) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tw4QU-0007GV-Vp for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Mar 2025 15:22:35 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tw4QN-0006RA-UM; Sat, 22 Mar 2025 15:22:27 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=SF7wZOwcRznDsb73HiwUFCoumZ5nJTwcqi9yDK+JjA0=; b=ToL/du3U+Wjw54fH8MKA ruJ0pxpozGm5ajPhdwIUmsfArpvg5f3RL20NDRPe2VDBc2GssozRlAIX0dOVlWqzcp+Dt6WAU267I evVmAYFcUMeBzKh5eJlFN1x3HBaY9vW980piZ3HSkSloDsodFSApen+rpTUzkBcyC0x0VmxdEwY0T qAIZIBCrGxl7TNPnPX76gS/Yrdsjsk8reWj7zKY4kMejqM3B7KFvd6asl6e36E6E6EBt5A9RF7EVr NdsmHLpzl9RdfyaoH+KRvff79DUxMfNRW/cjLBrg0gIE/tgeIEt3OBOIoUc1WZ5ho70O9i7WDpUhQ 8iYFyoYx31kKxQ==; Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 21:22:08 +0200 Message-Id: <868qowj2fz.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?= =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Sat, 22 Mar 2025 18:43:58 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, aaronjensen@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> > Cc: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, > 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 18:43:58 +0100 > > Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: > > > I'm afraid you will need to come up with a reproduction recipe for > > this, so that we could investigate what causes this. Maybe it's a bug > > or maybe I'm missing something. > > If it's something in Aaron's config, maybe he could bisect this. I hope so. > I'd also look for something doing things to mode-line-format first, > maybe. But I also have no real idea what that is. Given that the glyph rows in question have their mode_line_p flag reset, is that still a possibility?
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b714:5700:7102:57a0:fb2f:1f7a]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-43d4fd277d5sm62773805e9.19.2025.03.22.10.43.58 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sat, 22 Mar 2025 10:43:59 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS In-Reply-To: <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 18:43:58 +0100 Message-ID: <m234f57yg1.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: >> From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> >> Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 09:47:47 -0700 >> Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org >>=20 >> On Sat, Mar 22, 2025 at 9:41 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: >>=20 >> From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>=20 >> Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 09:17:08 -0700=20 >> Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org >>=20 >> In my config, I definitely see matrix comparisons when hidden buffers a= re updated. It's >> row_equal_p and update_text_area that are called in rapid succession ev= en when the shell >> buffer is not visible. I tried disabling both my tab bar and my header = line (I don't use a mode line) >> and I still saw it updating.=20 >>=20 >> Here's an example log output, this repeats as quickly as yes emits "y"= =20 >>=20 >> dispnew.c:4775=20 >> dispnew.c:1295=20 >> dispnew.c:1295=20 >> dispnew.c:1295=20 >> dispnew.c:1295=20 >> dispnew.c:1295=20 >> dispnew.c:1295=20 >> dispnew.c:1295=20 >> dispnew.c:4775 >>=20 >> Is the mode_line_p flag of the glyph row set when these comparisons are= made? >>=20 >> I see this: >>=20 >> update_text_area updated_row->mode_line_p: 0 >> update_text_area updated_row->mode_line_p: 1 >> row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 >> row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 >> row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 >> row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 >> row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 >> row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 >> row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 >> row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 >> row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 >> row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 >> row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 >> row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 >> =E2=80=A6 Many more of these in each iteration =E2=80=A6 >>=20 >> So it's set in one update_text_area, but not another. > > I'm afraid you will need to come up with a reproduction recipe for > this, so that we could investigate what causes this. Maybe it's a bug > or maybe I'm missing something. If it's something in Aaron's config, maybe he could bisect this. I'd also look for something doing things to mode-line-format first, maybe. But I also have no real idea what that is.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Mar 2025 17:09:47 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sat Mar 22 13:09:47 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45185 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tw2Ly-000741-LE for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Mar 2025 13:09:47 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:33298) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tw2Lv-00073j-UM for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Mar 2025 13:09:44 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tw2Lp-0007Qw-FG; Sat, 22 Mar 2025 13:09:37 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=BiOWHWtosH3nBZRqIjXwhT3g/Onaj26oKQ91OZpHP64=; b=oUOOlUh2GQ6fTcT0O2Mf i2Us9KBCW+9u9bTTY7LUmnqwcJVxjlp8O2pXJRlft8nE1EatKHrbd3AANSuMyDTcXURll5hlHhfLN OhdkD9DzxX25o6R49jrboXLJPQpXfsGebPGHzmn5bWMrzXRKIE5Vx+ZmV4WAvIHG2CpQlHpugBaAK cdVoJyuX3cyEJI8DfREDbRYNJD8Kxh6FCQPhSe1iVGcs4BGcjlFBKC9ooYwz266x54Wb2gc5G38xD AIi4azOzNQmDONOVg4H4LbRaLC1AhGtAWv7eEJFi1fMVuHf6ybwr0pK1wcpgnxUb1JPa6E7/Vkw8w fVixHobKsYP5tA==; Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 19:09:33 +0200 Message-Id: <86cye9hu0i.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> (message from Aaron Jensen on Sat, 22 Mar 2025 09:47:47 -0700) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wm=WxNdfwEg39fWXco8iOct6pcuKso6uYCOALJE_8cvw@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 09:47:47 -0700 > Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > On Sat, Mar 22, 2025 at 9:41 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: > > From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 09:17:08 -0700 > Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > In my config, I definitely see matrix comparisons when hidden buffers are updated. It's > row_equal_p and update_text_area that are called in rapid succession even when the shell > buffer is not visible. I tried disabling both my tab bar and my header line (I don't use a mode line) > and I still saw it updating. > > Here's an example log output, this repeats as quickly as yes emits "y" > > dispnew.c:4775 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:4775 > > Is the mode_line_p flag of the glyph row set when these comparisons are made? > > I see this: > > update_text_area updated_row->mode_line_p: 0 > update_text_area updated_row->mode_line_p: 1 > row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 > row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 > row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 > row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 > row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 > row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 > row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 > row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 > row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 > row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 > row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 > row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 > … Many more of these in each iteration … > > So it's set in one update_text_area, but not another. I'm afraid you will need to come up with a reproduction recipe for this, so that we could investigate what causes this. Maybe it's a bug or maybe I'm missing something.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Flickering on macOS To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000008433e80630f1210d" X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --0000000000008433e80630f1210d Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, Mar 22, 2025 at 9:41 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: > From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 09:17:08 -0700 > Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > In my config, I definitely see matrix comparisons when hidden buffers are > updated. It's row_equal_p and update_text_area that are called in rapid > succession even when the shell buffer is not visible. I tried disabling > both my tab bar and my header line (I don't use a mode line) and I still > saw it updating. > > Here's an example log output, this repeats as quickly as yes emits "y" > > dispnew.c:4775 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:4775 > > Is the mode_line_p flag of the glyph row set when these comparisons are > made? > I see this: update_text_area updated_row->mode_line_p: 0 update_text_area updated_row->mode_line_p: 1 row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0 =E2=80=A6 Many more of these in each iteration =E2=80=A6 So it's set in one update_text_area, but not another. Aaron --0000000000008433e80630f1210d Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla= ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color= :rgba(0,0,0,0.6)" class=3D"">On Sat, Mar 22, 2025 at 9:41 AM, Eli Zaretskii= </span><span dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" ta= rget=3D"_blank" class=3D"">eliz@HIDDEN</a>></span><span style=3D"backgr= ound-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)" class=3D""> wrote:</span><b= r></div></div></div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div c= lass=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 = 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_ext= ra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""></p><di= v class=3D"">From: Aaron Jensen <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener no= referrer" href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" class=3D"">aaronjensen@<wbr= >gmail.<wbr>com</a>> <br></div><div class=3D""> Date: <span class=3D"sh-= date">Sat</span>, <span class=3D"sh-date">22 Mar 2025</span> 09:17:08 -0700= <br></div><div class=3D""> Cc: <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener norefe= rrer" href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN" class=3D"">gerd.<wbr>moellma= nn@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>, <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer= " href=3D"mailto:alan@HIDDEN" class=3D"">alan@<wbr>idiocy.<wbr>org</a>,= <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:77039@debb= ugs.gnu.org" class=3D"">77039@<wbr>debbugs.<wbr>gnu.<wbr>org</a><br></div><= p></p><p class=3D"">In my config, I definitely see matrix comparisons when = hidden buffers are updated. It's row_equal_p and update_text_area that are called in rapid succession even when the shell bu= ffer is not visible. I tried disabling both my tab bar and my header line (I don't use a mode line) = and I still saw it updating. <br></p><p class=3D"">Here's an example lo= g output, this repeats as quickly as yes emits "y" <br></p><p cla= ss=3D""></p><div class=3D"">dispnew.c:4775 <br></div><div class=3D""> dispn= ew.c:1295 <br></div><div class=3D""> dispnew.c:1295 <br></div><div class=3D= ""> dispnew.c:1295 <br></div><div class=3D""> dispnew.c:1295 <br></div><div= class=3D""> dispnew.c:1295 <br></div><div class=3D""> dispnew.c:1295 <br><= /div><div class=3D""> dispnew.c:1295 <br></div><div class=3D""> dispnew.c:4= 775<br></div><p></p></blockquote><p class=3D"">Is the mode_line_p flag of t= he glyph row set when these comparisons are made?<br></p></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div><div clas= s=3D""><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">I see this:<br></div><div = class=3D""><br></div></div><div class=3D"">update_text_area updated_row->= ;mode_line_p: 0<br></div><div class=3D"">update_text_area updated_row->m= ode_line_p: 1<br></div><div class=3D"">row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b-&= gt;mode_line_p: 0<br></div><div class=3D"">row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0= b->mode_line_p: 0<br></div><div class=3D"">row_equal_p a->mode_line_= p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0<br></div><div class=3D"">row_equal_p a->mode_l= ine_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0<br></div><div class=3D"">row_equal_p a->mo= de_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0<br></div><div class=3D"">row_equal_p a-&g= t;mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0<br></div><div class=3D"">row_equal_p = a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0<br></div><div class=3D"">row_equa= l_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0<br></div><div class=3D"">row_= equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0<br></div><div class=3D"">= row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0<br></div><div class= =3D"">row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0<br></div><div c= lass=3D"">row_equal_p a->mode_line_p: 0 b->mode_line_p: 0<br></div><d= iv class=3D"">=E2=80=A6 Many=C2=A0more of these in each iteration =E2=80=A6= <br></div><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">So it's set in one = update_text_area, but not another.<br></div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""= ><br></div></div><div class=3D"">Aaron</div></div><div></div></div></body><= /html> --0000000000008433e80630f1210d--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Mar 2025 16:42:04 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sat Mar 22 12:42:04 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44973 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tw1vA-0005bD-Ev for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Mar 2025 12:42:04 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:50852) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tw1v7-0005ac-KJ for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Mar 2025 12:42:02 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tw1v1-00010X-Fc; Sat, 22 Mar 2025 12:41:55 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=yYPYleTquTALklozrIX1zCiov9Nusbe9DLFrlmkkTBA=; b=JFSAkSVD7eIw 8eG/IZS5fJqdjoa+udrofN6rpi+3gYxtLExQEF74PpMAGBVk6p7YUKlUGyh60dabZQkDLvoDlQWUo j8HcZVruEI/ixUwGDIXDUZORJ5E48uyXTLOk+jGYrU4JvUIQpHSCas8NZI1UhORSPwSxLUTU0Aw4i MpUiD12DHoWeOxNCyE//BV+87bMWcSpIwyadUmCglCcPKWNJGB1hBK978V2jt6+pjRmoCIvi1fLyQ neeESYKE1r4RpKIJM45bb03uJj7u7PdKD55IDCjBrIJ9EE3SA/HmmtOZLdbqO+zJ5tcW+hOPFF3Oy P5IYqls5V3n2hmG+GaQ15Q==; Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 18:41:50 +0200 Message-Id: <86frj5hvap.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> (message from Aaron Jensen on Sat, 22 Mar 2025 09:17:08 -0700) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wsWh+4f2VFNWJbtt5x7bJ-F=cmb9ZndrAsJ_H5Rg-c2Q@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > Date: Sat, 22 Mar 2025 09:17:08 -0700 > Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > In my config, I definitely see matrix comparisons when hidden buffers are updated. It's row_equal_p and > update_text_area that are called in rapid succession even when the shell buffer is not visible. I tried > disabling both my tab bar and my header line (I don't use a mode line) and I still saw it updating. > > Here's an example log output, this repeats as quickly as yes emits "y" > > dispnew.c:4775 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:1295 > dispnew.c:4775 Is the mode_line_p flag of the glyph row set when these comparisons are made?
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Flickering on macOS To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000f0b21a0630f0b3f1" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --000000000000f0b21a0630f0b3f1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Mar 18, 2025 at 9:52 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: > From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2025 15:32:41 +0000 > Cc: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039= @ > debbugs.gnu.org > > Yes, redisplay should be a nop, since the buffer which is modified is not > displayed. > > But Aaron seems to say we keep comparing the glyph matrices of the window > which is not show, something that should not happen, because we don't cal= l > update_frame on frames that are not visible. > > I tried to explain that I wasn't convinced that it was that, that it coul= d > have, and even likely was, a redisplay of the currently displayed buffer > (which is why *it* was flickering). Unless anyone thinks that there is > reason to investigate further, I'm satisfied with the answer that reading > process output can cause a comparison of glyphs, which is unlikely to > result in a redisplay of an unrelated buffer. > > Reading process output is not supposed to cause comparison of glyphs if > the buffer to which process output is directed is not being displayed. So > if you do see glyphs being compared in that case, we should look into tha= t. > The only glyphs that could be legitimately compared in that case are thos= e > on the mode line. > In my config, I definitely see matrix comparisons when hidden buffers are updated. It's row_equal_p and update_text_area that are called in rapid succession even when the shell buffer is not visible. I tried disabling both my tab bar and my header line (I don't use a mode line) and I still saw it updating. Here's an example log output, this repeats as quickly as yes emits "y" dispnew.c:4775 dispnew.c:1295 dispnew.c:1295 dispnew.c:1295 dispnew.c:1295 dispnew.c:1295 dispnew.c:1295 dispnew.c:1295 dispnew.c:4775 I can't reproduce this with emacs -Q, unfortunately. It seems to be have as you described. Hidden buffers do not cause comparisons. Aaron --000000000000f0b21a0630f0b3f1 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla= ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color= :rgba(0,0,0,0.6)">On Tue, Mar 18, 2025 at 9:52 AM, Eli Zaretskii </span><sp= an dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" target=3D"_bl= ank" class=3D"">eliz@HIDDEN</a>></span><span style=3D"background-color:= rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)"> wrote:</span></div></div></div><div c= lass=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><bloc= kquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #cc= c solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_qu= ote"><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> From: Aaron Jensen <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" hre= f=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" class=3D"">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>c= om</a>> <br> Date: <span class=3D"sh-date">Tue</span>, <span class=3D"sh-date">18 Mar 20= 25</span> 15:32:41 +0000 <br> Cc: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer"= href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN" class=3D"">gerd.<wbr>moellmann@<w= br>gmail.<wbr>com</a>>, <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer"= href=3D"mailto:alan@HIDDEN" class=3D"">alan@<wbr>idiocy.<wbr>org</a>,= =20 <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:77039@debb= ugs.gnu.org" class=3D"">77039@<wbr>debbugs.<wbr>gnu.<wbr>org</a> </p><p class=3D""> Yes, redisplay should be a nop, since the buffer which is modified is not d= isplayed.=20 <br></p><p class=3D""> But Aaron seems to say we keep comparing the glyph matrices of the window w= hich is not show, something that should not happen, because we don't call update_frame on= frames that are not visible. <br></p><p class=3D""> I tried to explain that I wasn't convinced that it was that, that it co= uld have, and even likely was, a redisplay of the currently displayed buffer (which is why *it* was flickering). Unless a= nyone thinks that there is reason to investigate further, I'm satisfied with the answer that reading process= output can cause a comparison of glyphs, which is unlikely to result in a redisplay of an unrelated buffer. <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> Reading process output is not supposed to cause comparison of glyphs if the buffer to which process output is directed is not being displayed. So if you do see glyphs being compared in that case, we should look into that. The only glyphs that could be legitimately compared in that case are those on the mode line.<br></p></div></div></bloc= kquote></div></div></div></div><div><div><br></div><div>In my config, I def= initely see matrix comparisons when hidden buffers are updated. It's ro= w_equal_p and update_text_area that are called in rapid succession even whe= n the shell buffer is not visible.=C2=A0 I tried disabling both my tab bar = and my header line (I don't use a mode line) and I still saw it updatin= g.=C2=A0<br></div><div><br></div><div>Here's an example log output, thi= s repeats as quickly as yes emits "y"</div><div><br></div></div><= div>dispnew.c:4775<br></div><div>dispnew.c:1295<br></div><div>dispnew.c:129= 5<br></div><div>dispnew.c:1295<br></div><div>dispnew.c:1295<br></div><div>d= ispnew.c:1295<br></div><div>dispnew.c:1295<br></div><div>dispnew.c:1295<br>= </div><div>dispnew.c:4775<br></div><div><br></div><div><div>I can't rep= roduce this with emacs -Q, unfortunately. It seems to be have as you descri= bed. Hidden buffers do not cause comparisons.</div></div><div><br></div><di= v>Aaron</div></div><div></div></div></body></html> --000000000000f0b21a0630f0b3f1--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 18 Mar 2025 16:53:03 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Mar 18 12:53:03 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42800 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tuaBa-0008Mo-Gs for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 18 Mar 2025 12:53:02 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:47492) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tuaBX-0008MG-IC for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 18 Mar 2025 12:53:00 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tuaBO-0001RL-AY; Tue, 18 Mar 2025 12:52:51 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=Kh6ItI5wFOqXvK6KdOxNetUadhnqMLyVq6fzTay7JaQ=; b=jwUqX5iSf8w8ySfEqkfz c+A2b0nZPhgwHP1DsIQWqJyNYJPsV/Jz6d5WeM+t1s518HVrIUCo4x7EFmfFDma4cFFAcKisDj46r jbDCpsug1F0JU06x13JwI7eH6Suj3TrvZPqadPfvhBjd+vwycJS0lWll1x6LdADB2mR2fclFFZjwe 2P7R8pLsYgd3W8OZekCnoyOJWNX7EOBzug9HlM5oYIo+wDm4e2Q0kIwCNkvLlQ5bW4rX7Rv3G+5eb 3oVmgUx93ymbSjqGGK94ZTwT9BVjnX+eulPG2cGVoJr818k7bfhr5C83SpQcowwWtwpibFC8L7wW6 H0v6VNlW26LU2Q==; Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2025 18:52:08 +0200 Message-Id: <867c4mqo1z.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> (message from Aaron Jensen on Tue, 18 Mar 2025 15:32:41 +0000) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yYJkPSUMCdRhZVxH0XVv61E0-+Zu_84M3QAtS5VPpCnw@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2025 15:32:41 +0000 > Cc: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, > 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > Yes, redisplay should be a nop, since the buffer which is modified is not displayed. > > But Aaron seems to say we keep comparing the glyph matrices of the window which is not show, > something that should not happen, because we don't call update_frame on frames that are not visible. > > I tried to explain that I wasn't convinced that it was that, that it could have, and even likely was, a redisplay of > the currently displayed buffer (which is why *it* was flickering). Unless anyone thinks that there is reason to > investigate further, I'm satisfied with the answer that reading process output can cause a comparison of > glyphs, which is unlikely to result in a redisplay of an unrelated buffer. Reading process output is not supposed to cause comparison of glyphs if the buffer to which process output is directed is not being displayed. So if you do see glyphs being compared in that case, we should look into that. The only glyphs that could be legitimately compared in that case are those on the mode line. > If you'd like me to try the FILE/LINE logging, please let me know and I'd be happy to do it. If the above means you see something that shouldn't happen, then yes, please provide the traces.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Flickering on macOS To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000a646c106309f9d6c" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --000000000000a646c106309f9d6c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Tue, Mar 18, 2025 at 6:19 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: > From: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <el= iz@ > gnu.org>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2025 > 07:02:53 +0100 > > Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > > Not Lisp, but: > > emacs -Q > M-x shell > yes<enter> > C-x b<enter> > > This will open a shell in a background buffer that is rapidly printing to > STDOUT (and displaying in the shell buffer) then switch to the scratch > buffer. If you add logging to the matrix comparisons you will see a rapid > uptick. I don't know if this has to do with the external process connecti= on > with Emacs. > > To be clear, I don't know if this is actually an issue given that the > matrix comparison is likely preventing the redisplay. > > Aaron > > When I configure with --enable-checking=3Dglyphs, and run, in emacs -Q, G= UI > version the function > > (defun foo () > (interactive) > (trace-redisplay 1) > (term "/usr/bin/yes") > (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*")) > > I see traces of the form > > redisplay_preserve_echo_area (12) > redisplay_internal 0 > redisplay_preserve_echo_area (12) > redisplay_internal 0 > ... > > The 12 means the call is from wait_reading_process_output, which reads th= e > output from /usr/bin/yes in this case. > > So, that explains where the redisplay comes from. Since there are no > further redisplay actions shown in the trace output, I think that redispl= ay > is more or less a nop in these cases. Didn't try without the fix that I > pushed. > > Yes, redisplay should be a nop, since the buffer which is modified is not > displayed. > > But Aaron seems to say we keep comparing the glyph matrices of the window > which is not show, something that should not happen, because we don't cal= l > update_frame on frames that are not visible. > I tried to explain that I wasn't convinced that it was that, that it could have, and even likely was, a redisplay of the currently displayed buffer (which is why *it* was flickering). Unless anyone thinks that there is reason to investigate further, I'm satisfied with the answer that reading process output can cause a comparison of glyphs, which is unlikely to result in a redisplay of an unrelated buffer. If you'd like me to try the FILE/LINE logging, please let me know and I'd be happy to do it. Thanks, Aaron --000000000000a646c106309f9d6c Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla= ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color= :rgba(0,0,0,0.6)">On Tue, Mar 18, 2025 at 6:19 AM, Eli Zaretskii </span><sp= an dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" target=3D"_bl= ank" class=3D"">eliz@HIDDEN</a>></span><span style=3D"background-color:= rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)"> wrote:</span></div></div></div><div c= lass=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><bloc= kquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #cc= c solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_qu= ote"><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> From: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferre= r" href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN" class=3D"">gerd.<wbr>moellmann@= <wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href= =3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" class=3D"">eliz@<wbr>gnu.<wbr>org</a>>, <a tar= get=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:alan@HIDDEN" = class=3D"">alan@<wbr>idiocy.<wbr>org</a>, <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noop= ener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org" class=3D"">77039@<wb= r>debbugs.<wbr>gnu.<wbr>org</a> Date: <span class=3D"sh-date">Tue</span>, <span class=3D"sh-date">18 Mar 20= 25</span> 07:02:53 +0100 <br></p><p class=3D""> Aaron Jensen <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"m= ailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" class=3D"">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>= > writes: <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> Not Lisp, but: <br></p><p class=3D""> emacs -Q <br> M-x shell <br> yes<enter> <br> C-x b<enter> </p><p class=3D""> This will open a shell in a background buffer that is rapidly printing to S= TDOUT (and displaying in the shell buffer) then switch to the scratch buffer. If you add logging to = the matrix comparisons you will see a rapid uptick. I don't know if this has to do with the extern= al process connection with Emacs.=20 <br></p><p class=3D""> To be clear, I don't know if this is actually an issue given that the m= atrix comparison is likely preventing the redisplay. <br></p><p class=3D""> Aaron <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> When I configure with --enable-checking=3Dglyphs, and run, in emacs -Q, GUI version the function <br></p><p class=3D""> (defun foo () <br> (interactive) <br> (trace-redisplay 1) <br> (term "/usr/bin/yes") <br> (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*")) </p><p class=3D""> I see traces of the form=20 <br></p><p class=3D""> redisplay_preserve_echo_area (12) <br> redisplay_internal 0 <br> redisplay_preserve_echo_area (12) <br> redisplay_internal 0 <br> ... </p><p class=3D""> The 12 means the call is from wait_reading_process_output, which reads the output from /usr/bin/yes in this case. <br></p><p class=3D""> So, that explains where the redisplay comes from. Since there are no further redisplay actions shown in the trace output, I think that redisplay is more or less a nop in these cases. Didn't try without the fix that I pushed. <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> Yes, redisplay should be a nop, since the buffer which is modified is not displayed. <br></p><p class=3D""> But Aaron seems to say we keep comparing the glyph matrices of the window which is not show, something that should not happen, because we don't call update_frame on frames that are not visible.<br></p></div></= div></blockquote></div></div></div></div><div><div><br></div><div>I tried t= o explain that I wasn't convinced that it was that, that it could have,= and even likely was, a redisplay of the currently displayed buffer (which = is why *it* was flickering). Unless anyone thinks that there is reason to i= nvestigate further, I'm satisfied with the answer that reading process = output can cause a comparison of glyphs, which is unlikely to result in a r= edisplay of an unrelated buffer.<br></div><div><br></div><div>If you'd = like me to try the FILE/LINE logging, please let me know and I'd be hap= py to do it.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks,</div><div><br></div></d= iv><div>Aaron</div></div><div></div></div></body></html> --000000000000a646c106309f9d6c--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 18 Mar 2025 14:10:20 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Mar 18 10:10:20 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41408 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tuXe7-0002Aa-Sr for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 18 Mar 2025 10:10:20 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:56234) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tuXe4-00027O-2q for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 18 Mar 2025 10:10:17 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tuXdx-0004Ag-8y; Tue, 18 Mar 2025 10:10:09 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=sC/V4HwVB4p+6ce9jECdI9/DNK7rF64t661i24mUAsk=; b=NK3252hJQsos7h7MDnzD ZTXIwU8AHAHbgCRXoeHH15KYBTFCumQGP2Sy/w1f/72BHCCL9ha+5zvm7s6IQEIA6e0ncfPVPlfay Zy4+S/cLmcr6kU+L2Wtfw9VaMLSmmjsNLzWd8Msd2z9YeFg4XeNEbyNd0gAtH538zaFeGwGfT9/Lh q2UUsTG4rjLLUxKnCtb9cXbXEiCKq4l60aKJseTjQaVPbadxcbxEF4GrBP3f3WpkXKdZkYv7zdIgP nvjZc6Q7NDLpaqR7NDeZhA9fuNWWFgWCBlny8oeFsN4I2bPtX5+g32zlRgkX+4q99IhTDdG6+Vlso s4eZwwaSZy2uAw==; Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2025 16:09:23 +0200 Message-Id: <868qp2qvl8.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <m25xk6mo47.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?= =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Tue, 18 Mar 2025 15:04:24 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> <m25xk6mo47.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, aaronjensen@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> > Cc: aaronjensen@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2025 15:04:24 +0100 > > Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: > > > But Aaron seems to say we keep comparing the glyph matrices of the > > window which is not show, something that should not happen, because we > > don't call update_frame on frames that are not visible. > > Maybe Aaron could log __FILE__ and __LINE__ where he said he logged the > frames in the macros? That would help, yes.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b744:5700:a038:a5c5:3205:1aa9]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a640c23a62f3a-ac3149cdec8sm852670966b.112.2025.03.18.07.04.24 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Tue, 18 Mar 2025 07:04:25 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS In-Reply-To: <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2025 15:04:24 +0100 Message-ID: <m25xk6mo47.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, aaronjensen@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: > But Aaron seems to say we keep comparing the glyph matrices of the > window which is not show, something that should not happen, because we > don't call update_frame on frames that are not visible. Maybe Aaron could log __FILE__ and __LINE__ where he said he logged the frames in the macros?
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 18 Mar 2025 13:19:22 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Mar 18 09:19:21 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:38693 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tuWql-0003TS-N6 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 18 Mar 2025 09:19:21 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:55514) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tuWqh-0003SA-KP for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 18 Mar 2025 09:19:17 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tuWqa-0005j3-Lp; Tue, 18 Mar 2025 09:19:08 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=CkuibdHkeAnACO4NcpIoSHMBsUqwIZd5Sml94h4RbtQ=; b=GjNHZW40RiIMVWYlar5f DxM++dxqUh4goJS9re+T9tchNX/hSuyS3Y9dz38IaG1VbwaUznJGuRKIEckqLOzRyhnuWAB9Rsvr3 Xxw8qp9vFEog5nP/NNV1E5FO+lEmq/VANUVfTUwqcBWxDlqcbBznRyYqbrIgxh674NF72cbMF4S5m QVJjjRiUJaYPUXv+nHRO5kY1kreOZ3qnL7mkL3ds8WKbwzY9wOXdA/nHgUcOm6jHdfrRsuoaNXXQb JrVdA//KxBb07IolN2scPYir4JcBnra5xLTlqPpf6iYbl0pJ636JoEexLSIYhwNxSGKFC2WjH7Zgb ElwYIvoRdzdorw==; Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2025 15:19:00 +0200 Message-Id: <86h63qqxx7.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?= =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Tue, 18 Mar 2025 07:02:53 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, aaronjensen@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> > Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2025 07:02:53 +0100 > > Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > > > Not Lisp, but: > > > > emacs -Q > > M-x shell > > yes<enter> > > C-x b<enter> > > > > This will open a shell in a background buffer that is rapidly printing to STDOUT (and displaying in > > the shell buffer) then switch to the scratch buffer. If you add logging to the matrix comparisons you > > will see a rapid uptick. I don't know if this has to do with the external process connection with > > Emacs. > > > > To be clear, I don't know if this is actually an issue given that the matrix comparison is likely > > preventing the redisplay. > > > > Aaron > > When I configure with --enable-checking=glyphs, and run, in emacs -Q, > GUI version the function > > (defun foo () > (interactive) > (trace-redisplay 1) > (term "/usr/bin/yes") > (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*")) > > I see traces of the form > > redisplay_preserve_echo_area (12) > redisplay_internal 0 > redisplay_preserve_echo_area (12) > redisplay_internal 0 > ... > > The 12 means the call is from wait_reading_process_output, which reads > the output from /usr/bin/yes in this case. > > So, that explains where the redisplay comes from. Since there are no > further redisplay actions shown in the trace output, I think that > redisplay is more or less a nop in these cases. Didn't try without the > fix that I pushed. Yes, redisplay should be a nop, since the buffer which is modified is not displayed. But Aaron seems to say we keep comparing the glyph matrices of the window which is not show, something that should not happen, because we don't call update_frame on frames that are not visible.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b744:5700:a038:a5c5:3205:1aa9]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a640c23a62f3a-ac3146aecffsm794226666b.25.2025.03.18.00.55.22 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Tue, 18 Mar 2025 00:55:22 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS In-Reply-To: <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN> <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2025 08:55:21 +0100 Message-ID: <m2o6xyrcwm.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> writes: > Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > >> Not Lisp, but: >> >> emacs -Q >> M-x shell >> yes<enter> >> C-x b<enter> >> >> This will open a shell in a background buffer that is rapidly printing t= o STDOUT (and displaying in >> the shell buffer) then switch to the scratch buffer. If you add logging = to the matrix comparisons you >> will see a rapid uptick. I don't know if this has to do with the externa= l process connection with >> Emacs. >> >> To be clear, I don't know if this is actually an issue given that the ma= trix comparison is likely >> preventing the redisplay. >> >> Aaron > > When I configure with --enable-checking=3Dglyphs, and run, in emacs -Q, > GUI version the function > > (defun foo () > (interactive) > (trace-redisplay 1) > (term "/usr/bin/yes") > (switch-to-buffer "*scratch*")) > > I see traces of the form > > redisplay_preserve_echo_area (12) > redisplay_internal 0 > redisplay_preserve_echo_area (12) > redisplay_internal 0 > ... > > The 12 means the call is from wait_reading_process_output, which reads > the output from /usr/bin/yes in this case. > > So, that explains where the redisplay comes from. Since there are no > further redisplay actions shown in the trace output, I think that > redisplay is more or less a nop in these cases. Didn't try without the > fix that I pushed. > > Why wait_reading_process_output is called with argument do_display =3D=3D > true I have no idea. From reading the code a bit, where wait_reading_process_output is called, calling it with do_display =3D=3D true looks okay to me. It is sometimes necessary to redisplay, and checking the cases where it isn't is probably similarly expensive as just doing the redisplay. So, I propose to close the bug.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS
In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48zsYNZNZf6Ti6ARQ1N=TL4+oaOdyuLwMmpHWoK0VoE0Sw@HIDDEN>
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Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2025 07:02:53 +0100
Message-ID: <m2senari42.fsf@HIDDEN>
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Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
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Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes:
> Not Lisp, but:
>
> emacs -Q
> M-x shell
> yes<enter>
> C-x b<enter>
>
> This will open a shell in a background buffer that is rapidly printing to STDOUT (and displaying in
> the shell buffer) then switch to the scratch buffer. If you add logging to the matrix comparisons you
> will see a rapid uptick. I don't know if this has to do with the external process connection with
> Emacs.
>
> To be clear, I don't know if this is actually an issue given that the matrix comparison is likely
> preventing the redisplay.
>
> Aaron
When I configure with --enable-checking=glyphs, and run, in emacs -Q,
GUI version the function
(defun foo ()
(interactive)
(trace-redisplay 1)
(term "/usr/bin/yes")
(switch-to-buffer "*scratch*"))
I see traces of the form
redisplay_preserve_echo_area (12)
redisplay_internal 0
redisplay_preserve_echo_area (12)
redisplay_internal 0
...
The 12 means the call is from wait_reading_process_output, which reads
the output from /usr/bin/yes in this case.
So, that explains where the redisplay comes from. Since there are no
further redisplay actions shown in the trace output, I think that
redisplay is more or less a nop in these cases. Didn't try without the
fix that I pushed.
Why wait_reading_process_output is called with argument do_display ==
true I have no idea.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Flickering on macOS To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000002dda6806308cf015" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --0000000000002dda6806308cf015 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Mar 17, 2025 at 9:38 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: > From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2025 15:56:00 +0000 > Cc: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039= @ > debbugs.gnu.org > > If you are talking about comparing glyph matrices of windows/frames that > are not shown, that shouldn't happen. If it seems to happen, I'd need a > clear recipe where it does, which I could run on GNU/Linux or MS-Windows, > to debug this. Windows that are not displayed don't even have desired > matrices to compare, so I don't think I understand how this could be > possible. > > It's more likely that an update in a hidden buffer is causing a glyph > comparison on the displayed buffer given that it's the one that is > flickering. Because the buffer is updating so rapidly, this happens often= . > The hidden buffer is connected to an external process. You can simulate > this by running `yes` in a `term` and then hiding that buffer. Is that > expected? > > I don't think I understand the situation. If you can show some Lisp to > simulate that, it would help. > Not Lisp, but: emacs -Q M-x shell yes<enter> C-x b<enter> This will open a shell in a background buffer that is rapidly printing to STDOUT (and displaying in the shell buffer) then switch to the scratch buffer. If you add logging to the matrix comparisons you will see a rapid uptick. I don't know if this has to do with the external process connection with Emacs. To be clear, I don't know if this is actually an issue given that the matrix comparison is likely preventing the redisplay. Aaron --0000000000002dda6806308cf015 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla= ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color= :rgba(0,0,0,0.6)" class=3D"">On Mon, Mar 17, 2025 at 9:38 AM, Eli Zaretskii= </span><span dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" ta= rget=3D"_blank" class=3D"">eliz@HIDDEN</a>></span><span style=3D"backgr= ound-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)" class=3D""> wrote:</span><b= r></div></div></div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div c= lass=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 = 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_ext= ra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""></p><di= v class=3D"">From: Aaron Jensen <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener no= referrer" href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" class=3D"">aaronjensen@<wbr= >gmail.<wbr>com</a>> <br></div><div class=3D""> Date: <span class=3D"sh-= date">Mon</span>, <span class=3D"sh-date">17 Mar 2025</span> 15:56:00 +0000= <br></div><div class=3D""> Cc: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <<a target=3D"_blank"= rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN" class= =3D"">gerd.<wbr>moellmann@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>>, <a target=3D"_blank"= rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:alan@HIDDEN" class=3D"">ala= n@<wbr>idiocy.<wbr>org</a>, <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer= " href=3D"mailto:77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org" class=3D"">77039@<wbr>debbugs.<wbr>= gnu.<wbr>org</a><br></div><p></p><p class=3D"">If you are talking about com= paring glyph matrices of windows/frames that are not shown, that shouldn= 9;t happen. If it seems to happen, I'd need a clear recipe where it does, w= hich I could run on GNU/Linux or MS-Windows, to debug this. Windows that are not displayed don't even ha= ve desired matrices to compare, so I don't think I understand how this could be possible. <br>= </p><p class=3D"">It's more likely that an update in a hidden buffer is= causing a glyph comparison on the displayed buffer given that it's the one that is flickering. Because the buffer is updating so= rapidly, this happens often. The hidden buffer is connected to an external process. You can simulate this by runnin= g `yes` in a `term` and then hiding that buffer. Is that expected? <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D"">I = don't think I understand the situation. If you can show some Lisp to simulate that, it would help.<br></p></div></div></blockquote></div></di= v></div></div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">Not= Lisp, but:<br></div><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D""><span class= =3D"">emacs</span>=C2=A0-Q<br></div><div class=3D"">M-x shell<br></div><div= class=3D"">yes<enter><br></div><div class=3D"">C-x b<enter><br= ></div><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">This will open a shell in = a background buffer that is rapidly printing to STDOUT (and displaying in t= he shell buffer) then switch to the scratch buffer. If you add logging to t= he matrix comparisons you will see a rapid uptick. I don't know if this= has to do with the external process connection with Emacs. <br></div><div = class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">To be clear, I don't know if this = is actually an issue given that the matrix comparison is likely preventing= =C2=A0the redisplay.<br></div></div><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D= "">Aaron<br></div></div><div></div></div></body></html> --0000000000002dda6806308cf015--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 Mar 2025 16:38:43 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Mar 17 12:38:43 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:60511 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tuDUA-0007R1-G8 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 17 Mar 2025 12:38:42 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:51048) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tuDU7-0007Pl-9Q for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 17 Mar 2025 12:38:39 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tuDTz-0000Jy-2M; Mon, 17 Mar 2025 12:38:31 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=VMXUZUMGflxbLfrCi98ochUZrYGjTAkfRI12+CrZ+hA=; b=CkjBLGDoZOqgnOoaY9tS wxEzTwlIPkbN9YRgekzfTM05lwUlvOTj29wRSCr13uVRjGoKmYlwOjT/YMsUAR1gvqpxOw2BXIH3i KuVnS3MFfNwROJ+1tCNnTpw0NjxvXgLgMZRTPW8NtXIMQyKPIkOjGV0jMIuPxcV+wC6UQAXV5eS8p z7BFk3eZ9AoeHD33fO7HBX86cTxlLgKslYTx5mZIwxrayUiVpjSnunX+AXGsLt2dhPTqcZpNmENGA X0hDWvDqzEbuc0NgfsUeOINrlizvLSyHZqx9DQry/+ukbvygRXBV7uNipzfuO8upA+psULuOJj2s5 rJMVBUVr6OnQ4A==; Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2025 18:38:28 +0200 Message-Id: <864izrsjcr.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> (message from Aaron Jensen on Mon, 17 Mar 2025 15:56:00 +0000) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xyGdYy9zeFQ5_bh011L=j1pCj_eB6UKcyyd4yqWQEH3A@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2025 15:56:00 +0000 > Cc: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, > 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > If you are talking about comparing glyph matrices of windows/frames that are not shown, that shouldn't > happen. If it seems to happen, I'd need a clear recipe where it does, which I could run on GNU/Linux or > MS-Windows, to debug this. Windows that are not displayed don't even have desired matrices to > compare, so I don't think I understand how this could be possible. > > It's more likely that an update in a hidden buffer is causing a glyph comparison on the displayed buffer given > that it's the one that is flickering. Because the buffer is updating so rapidly, this happens often. The hidden > buffer is connected to an external process. You can simulate this by running `yes` in a `term` and then > hiding that buffer. Is that expected? I don't think I understand the situation. If you can show some Lisp to simulate that, it would help.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Flickering on macOS To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000035e01306308bd33a" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>, alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --00000000000035e01306308bd33a Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Mar 17, 2025 at 5:39 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: > Cc: Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org From: Gerd > M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2025 05:20:11 = +0100 > > Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > > Does that also happen when you use something else than vterm, say M-x > shell or M-x eshell? > > Yes, it happens with shell and term as well > > To me that looks as if this shouldn't happen. At least judging from what = I > remember from the times of Emacs 21. > > Maybe Eli has an idea what could cause this. It might be worth submitting > another bug for this. > > If you are talking about comparing glyph matrices of windows/frames that > are not shown, that shouldn't happen. If it seems to happen, I'd need a > clear recipe where it does, which I could run on GNU/Linux or MS-Windows, > to debug this. Windows that are not displayed don't even have desired > matrices to compare, so I don't think I understand how this could be > possible. > It's more likely that an update in a hidden buffer is causing a glyph comparison on the displayed buffer given that it's the one that is flickering. Because the buffer is updating so rapidly, this happens often. The hidden buffer is connected to an external process. You can simulate this by running `yes` in a `term` and then hiding that buffer. Is that expected? > Is it clear to you why the glyph comparison failing would lead to > flickering, even with double buffering enabled? > > Heard about the double-buffering feature the first time yesterday, I > think. I had it in a branch in Emacs 21, but I guess it's not that one > :-). Or IOW, no idea. It might depend on how that's implemented. > > If glyph comparison fails, Emacs will redraw the screen. Whether it shoul= d > be visible with double-buffering depends on how that was implemented on > macOS, and what exactly "flickers" as part of > "flickering". > Ok, then yea it's very possible that the particular method used is susceptible to flickering. Thanks. Aaron --00000000000035e01306308bd33a Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla= ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color= :rgba(0,0,0,0.6)">On Mon, Mar 17, 2025 at 5:39 AM, Eli Zaretskii </span><sp= an dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" target=3D"_bl= ank" class=3D"">eliz@HIDDEN</a>></span><span style=3D"background-color:= rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)"> wrote:</span></div></div></div><div c= lass=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><bloc= kquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #cc= c solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_qu= ote"><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> Cc: Alan Third <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D= "mailto:alan@HIDDEN" class=3D"">alan@<wbr>idiocy.<wbr>org</a>>, <a t= arget=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:77039@HIDDEN= nu.org" class=3D"">77039@<wbr>debbugs.<wbr>gnu.<wbr>org</a> From: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferre= r" href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN" class=3D"">gerd.<wbr>moellmann@= <wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>> Date: <span class=3D"sh-date">Mon</span>, <span class=3D"sh-date">17 Mar 20= 25</span> 05:20:11 +0100 <br></p><p class=3D""> Aaron Jensen <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"m= ailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" class=3D"">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>= > writes: <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> Does that also happen when you use something else than vterm, say M-x shell= or M-x eshell? <br></p><p class=3D""> Yes, it happens with shell and term as well <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> To me that looks as if this shouldn't happen. At least judging from wha= t I remember from the times of Emacs 21. <br></p><p class=3D""> Maybe Eli has an idea what could cause this. It might be worth submitting another bug for this. <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> If you are talking about comparing glyph matrices of windows/frames that are not shown, that shouldn't happen. If it seems to happen, I= 9;d need a clear recipe where it does, which I could run on GNU/Linux or MS-Windows, to debug this. Windows that are not displayed don't even have desired matrices to compare, so I don't think I understand how this could be possible.<br></p></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><= /div><div><div><br></div><div>It's=C2=A0more likely that an update in a= hidden buffer is causing a glyph comparison on the displayed buffer given = that it's the one that is flickering. Because the buffer is updating so= rapidly, this happens often. The hidden buffer is connected to an external= process. You can simulate this by running `yes` in a `term` and then hidin= g that buffer. Is that expected?</div><div><br></div></div><div class=3D"">= <div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote"= ><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1= px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gm= ail_quote"><p class=3D""> <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> Is it clear to you why the glyph comparison failing would lead to flickering, even with double buffering enabled? <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> Heard about the double-buffering feature the first time yesterday, I think. I had it in a branch in Emacs 21, but I guess it's not that one <br> :-). Or IOW, no idea. It might depend on how that's implemented. </p></blockquote><p class=3D""> If glyph comparison fails, Emacs will redraw the screen. Whether it should be visible with double-buffering depends on how that was implemented on macOS, and what exactly "flickers" as part of <br> "flickering".</p></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div= ><div><div><br></div><div>Ok, then yea it's very possible that the part= icular method used is susceptible to flickering. Thanks.<br></div><div><br>= </div><div>Aaron</div><div><br></div></div><div><br></div></div><div></div>= </div></body></html> --00000000000035e01306308bd33a--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 Mar 2025 12:39:22 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Mar 17 08:39:21 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56561 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tu9kW-0005nt-UO for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 17 Mar 2025 08:39:21 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:33958) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tu9kT-0005mf-MB for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 17 Mar 2025 08:39:19 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tu9kL-0006EQ-1W; Mon, 17 Mar 2025 08:39:10 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=k5Stx+3Fo1A6vf9z5LuLPRF11wvVBsHzX5OOUOsNTfs=; b=jWUnFtxLK/hTSyI+EpMA ZXTPBK7111UzElQg26a0SrJcoTAvGvsDp1+lSag3xSugGgGTEyduAMuH6bQE9Pj6uRTN9KoqpLmZ3 MPjzMsXKqIXGUKJtXhHe4n3SzPDrXEzE3Yfa18lC4OBArHxtqxu/RSbACBBa9bLw1fqhz+B6EI6V9 XnwIgRmst75WL/mMsA5eMxDjeo9Hxzc7Ug90Qg1z+J9jFvrt6HG8r8TBffjJSYWnSjNGoJVNOARv/ DQgzLbKdI52Bc46CVMmDx0ZVFJgGFV7xB1kdfWRGeCMjFlkcKXK5Qdbc4p3rV8lI9HdW6bRZz6GeW ZFlgZb1pIsMYZQ==; Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2025 14:39:05 +0200 Message-Id: <86tt7rsufq.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?= =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Mon, 17 Mar 2025 05:20:11 +0100) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: alan@HIDDEN, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, aaronjensen@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Cc: Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> > Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2025 05:20:11 +0100 > > Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > > > Does that also happen when you use something else than vterm, say M-x shell or M-x eshell? > > > > Yes, it happens with shell and term as well > > To me that looks as if this shouldn't happen. At least judging from what > I remember from the times of Emacs 21. > > Maybe Eli has an idea what could cause this. It might be worth submitting > another bug for this. If you are talking about comparing glyph matrices of windows/frames that are not shown, that shouldn't happen. If it seems to happen, I'd need a clear recipe where it does, which I could run on GNU/Linux or MS-Windows, to debug this. Windows that are not displayed don't even have desired matrices to compare, so I don't think I understand how this could be possible. > > Is it clear to you why the glyph comparison failing would lead to > > flickering, even with double buffering enabled? > > Heard about the double-buffering feature the first time yesterday, I > think. I had it in a branch in Emacs 21, but I guess it's not that one > :-). Or IOW, no idea. It might depend on how that's implemented. If glyph comparison fails, Emacs will redraw the screen. Whether it should be visible with double-buffering depends on how that was implemented on macOS, and what exactly "flickers" as part of "flickering".
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b733:9900:f02e:3520:5d29:6d31]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a640c23a62f3a-ac3149d0077sm598515966b.93.2025.03.16.21.20.11 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 16 Mar 2025 21:20:11 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2025 05:20:11 +0100 Message-ID: <m2y0x45lvo.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > That sounds suspicious. So you have one window W displaying some > innocuous buffer B, and another vterm buffer V that is not displayed > anywhere. The shell in V runs something producing output. That does > not change B, and also not something visible in W, including > mode-line or such or maybe frame title. And that leads to some > redisplay of W? > > Yes, all of that is true. I can't say whether or not it leads to a > redisplay of W, I just know right now that it leads to glyph > comparisons and somehow that leads to flickering in W, so maybe that's > enough to infer that it's a redisplay of W. I think one can say that, yes. The glyph comparisons are done in the part of redisplay that I call "update" which writes to the screen. (Looking at redisplay from sufficient height, how it works is like this, for a window on a window-system frame: It maintains two glyph matrices, the so-called current and the desired one. The current glyph matrix corresponds 1:1 to what is currently visible on the screen, and the desired one represents what should be on the screen. Redisplay builds the desired one, then compares current and desired matrix, and writes the difference to the screen. That's of course a gross simplification. Anyway, the comparison step above is where these "equal macros" come into play. So we're pretty deep in redisplay, I'd say. BTW, there's a large comment at the start of xdisp.c which explains it hopefully a bit better, should you be interested.) > Does that also happen when you use something else than vterm, say M-x shell or M-x eshell? > > Yes, it happens with shell and term as well To me that looks as if this shouldn't happen. At least judging from what I remember from the times of Emacs 21. Maybe Eli has an idea what could cause this. It might be worth submitting another bug for this. > Now pushed. Thanks for the very helpful hint! > > Thank you for the quick fix. > > Is it clear to you why the glyph comparison failing would lead to > flickering, even with double buffering enabled? Heard about the double-buffering feature the first time yesterday, I think. I had it in a branch in Emacs 21, but I guess it's not that one :-). Or IOW, no idea. It might depend on how that's implemented.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Sun, 16 Mar 2025 14:20:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 649336022844 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 16 Mar 2025 21:20:01 +0000 Received: from 649336022844 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 16 Mar 2025 21:20:01 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Superhuman-Draft-ID: draft000ed2523943f8a4 In-Reply-To: <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> X-Superhuman-ID: m8c52k91.c23c7a8d-9146-4b28-a5bd-4102b60d4899 References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Mailer: Superhuman Desktop (2025-03-14T21:48:50Z) Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 21:20:01 +0000 X-Gm-Features: AQ5f1JpRrzJhM-VXqdDQ5iJHJsz1Y_BKwOukBbtoiyrL0LnnHI3Ch-dSW9Qv9KY Message-ID: <CAHyO48zVCk0rccKzZPiJ19oQOoj5bhigGVRih9pERHMxKj0Tvw@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS To: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000000f834f06307c3c74" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --0000000000000f834f06307c3c74 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 1:13 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN= om> wrote: > Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > > Could you please try if the attached change works for you (without your > patch)? > > I was just about to send you log output that showed seemingly random > values in glyph::frame. You beat me to it. > > =F0=9F=91=8D > > This patch appears to fix the problem for me, thank you. > > Thanks. > > Is this the only place that they need to be initialized? Was it more than > glyph::frame that was uninitialized (and was that problematic)? > > adjust_glyph_matrix is the only place where these glyph allocations > happen, for window-systems. For completeness, let be just say that glyphs > matrices on ttys function differently. And the whole struct glyphs in a > glyph row were uninitialized because they are allocated via C's realloc. = I > don't think this being uninitialized was a problem before, the problem wa= s > only the combination with my assumption that the memory was zeroed. Don't > know where that assumption came from. Maybe I've misread them, or maybe > it's just that I hate leaving memory uninitialized in general and assumed= I > wouldn't have done it there. No idea. > > For my own edification, while logging GLYPH_EQUAL_P, I noticed that it's > invoked frequently for windows/buffers that are not visible. As in, while= a > hidden vterm buffer is accumulating log output and I only have a single > stationary buffer visible, I see a flood of log messages. Is this expecte= d? > It may very well be, I just don't know much about the rendering pipeline. > > That sounds suspicious. So you have one window W displaying some innocuou= s > buffer B, and another vterm buffer V that is not displayed anywhere. The > shell in V runs something producing output. That does not change B, and > also not something visible in W, including mode-line or such or maybe fra= me > title. And that leads to some redisplay of W? > Yes, all of that is true. I can't say whether or not it leads to a redisplay of W, I just know right now that it leads to glyph comparisons and somehow that leads to flickering in W, so maybe that's enough to infer that it's a redisplay of W. Does that also happen when you use something else than vterm, say M-x shell > or M-x eshell? > Yes, it happens with shell and term as well Now pushed. Thanks for the very helpful hint! Thank you for the quick fix. Is it clear to you why the glyph comparison failing would lead to flickering, even with double buffering enabled? Aaron --0000000000000f834f06307c3c74 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla= ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color= :rgba(0,0,0,0.6)" class=3D"">On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 1:13 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6l= lmann </span><span dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellm= ann@HIDDEN" target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN</a>>= ;</span><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)= " class=3D""> wrote:</span></div></div></div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-conten= t"><div class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_qu= ote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex= "><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><p class=3D"">Aaron= Jensen <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto= :aaronjensen@HIDDEN" class=3D"">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>> = writes: <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> Could you please try if the attached change works for you (without your pat= ch)? <br></p><p class=3D""> I was just about to send you log output that showed seemingly random values in glyph::frame. You beat me to it. <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> =F0=9F=91=8D <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> This patch appears to fix the problem for me, thank you. <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> Thanks. <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> Is this the only place that they need to be initialized? Was it more than glyph::frame that was uninitialized (and was that problematic)? <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> adjust_glyph_matrix is the only place where these glyph allocations happen, for window-systems. For completeness, let be just say that glyphs matrices on ttys function differently. And the whole struct glyphs in a glyph row were uninitialized because they are allocated via C's realloc. I don't think this being uninitialized was a problem before, the problem was only the combination with my assumption that the memory was zeroed. Don't know where that assumption came from. Maybe I've misread them, or maybe it's just that I hate leaving memory uninitialized in general and assumed I wouldn't have done it there. No idea. <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> For my own edification, while logging GLYPH_EQUAL_P, I noticed that it's invoked frequently for windows/buffers that are not visible. As in, while a hidden vterm buffer is accumulating log output and I only have a single stationary buffer visible, I see a flood of log messages. Is this expected? It may very well be, I just don't know much about the rendering pipeline. <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> That sounds suspicious. So you have one window W displaying some innocuous buffer B, and another vterm buffer V that is not displayed anywhere. The shell in V runs something producing output. That does not change B, and also not something visible in W, including mode-line or such or maybe frame title. And that leads to some redisplay of W?<br></p></= div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div><div><div><br></div><div>Yes= , all of that is true. I can't say whether or not it leads to a redispl= ay of W, I just know right now that it leads to glyph comparisons and someh= ow that leads to flickering in W, so maybe that's=C2=A0enough to infer = that it's a redisplay of W.=C2=A0</div><div> <br></div></div><div class=3D""><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class= =3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D= "margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class= =3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><p class=3D""> Does that also happen when you use something else than vterm, say M-x shell or M-x eshell?<br></p></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></di= v><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">Yes, it happens= with shell and term as well<br></div><div class=3D""><br></div></div><bloc= kquote style=3D"background-image:-webkit-linear-gradient(left,rgb(237,237,2= 37) 75%,rgb(237,237,237) 75%);background-size:1px 1px;background-position:l= eft;background-repeat:repeat-y;padding:0 0 0 20px"><div class=3D"">Now push= ed. Thanks for the very helpful hint!<br></div></blockquote><div><div><br><= /div><div>Thank you for the quick fix.<br></div><div><br></div><div>Is it c= lear to you why the glyph comparison=C2=A0failing would=C2=A0lead to flicke= ring, even with double buffering enabled?</div><div><br></div><div>Aaron</d= iv><div><br></div></div><div class=3D""><br></div></div><div></div></div></= body></html> --0000000000000f834f06307c3c74--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b737:9500:25f2:4de7:973e:1333]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-395cb7ea197sm12660933f8f.84.2025.03.16.13.31.31 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 16 Mar 2025 13:31:31 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS In-Reply-To: <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 21:31:30 +0100 Message-ID: <m234fc7m59.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> writes: >> This patch appears to fix the problem for me, thank you. > Now pushed. Thanks for the very helpful hint!
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b737:9500:25f2:4de7:973e:1333]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a640c23a62f3a-ac314a489e0sm536705766b.151.2025.03.16.13.13.44 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 16 Mar 2025 13:13:44 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <m2frjc7p6g.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48x9rruqGZ77GCQ+FGzfrstfSSMiLf9hxjBfk74xoMWKNw@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 21:13:43 +0100 Message-ID: <m27c4o7myw.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > Could you please try if the attached change works for you (without your = patch)? > > I was just about to send you log output that showed seemingly random > values in glyph::frame. You beat me to it. =F0=9F=91=8D > This patch appears to fix the problem for me, thank you. Thanks. > Is this the only place that they need to be initialized? Was it more > than glyph::frame that was uninitialized (and was that problematic)? adjust_glyph_matrix is the only place where these glyph allocations happen, for window-systems. For completeness, let be just say that glyphs matrices on ttys function differently. And the whole struct glyphs in a glyph row were uninitialized because they are allocated via C's realloc. I don't think this being uninitialized was a problem before, the problem was only the combination with my assumption that the memory was zeroed. Don't know where that assumption came from. Maybe I've misread them, or maybe it's just that I hate leaving memory uninitialized in general and assumed I wouldn't have done it there. No idea. > For my own edification, while logging GLYPH_EQUAL_P, I noticed that > it's invoked frequently for windows/buffers that are not visible. As > in, while a hidden vterm buffer is accumulating log output and I only > have a single stationary buffer visible, I see a flood of log > messages. Is this expected? It may very well be, I just don't know > much about the rendering pipeline. That sounds suspicious. So you have one window W displaying some innocuous buffer B, and another vterm buffer V that is not displayed anywhere. The shell in V runs something producing output. That does not change B, and also not something visible in W, including mode-line or such or maybe frame title. And that leads to some redisplay of W? Does that also happen when you use something else than vterm, say M-x shell or M-x eshell?
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>
Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 12:37:01 -0700
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Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS
To: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
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On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 12:25 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@gmail.=
com>
wrote:
> Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes:
>
> Hi,
>
> I've narrowed it down to the addition to frame in the glyph comparison. A=
s
> far as I can tell, the attached patch removes the flickering for me. I sa=
w
> the cursor blink once, but I couldn't reproduce that and I couldn't get i=
t
> to do it again.
>
> The patch is not suitable for applying to master as it certainly breaks
> something int he tty child frame code, but hopefully it gives you an idea
> of what the problem might be. I'm going to experiment with accounting for
> the NULL frame in the space glyph and see if that helps.
>
> Thanks Aaron, that was very helpful. I'm pretty sure it gave me right
> idea, namely... This in adjust_glyph_matrix
>
> dispnew.c:
> 505 while (row < end)
> 506 {
> 507 row->glyphs[LEFT_MARGIN_AREA] =3D 508 xnrealloc
> (row->glyphs[LEFT_MARGIN_AREA], 509 dim.width, sizeof (struct glyph));
>
> means that glyphs in window-system windows are not zeroed. Which in turn
> means that glyph::frame is not guaranteed to be NULL initially. And becau=
se
> I falsely assumed that to be the case, I didn't change the code producing
> glyphs for window-systems to set glyph::frame, which isn't needed or used
> on window-systems. And in the end, the glyph comparisons can fail.
>
> Or so is the hypothesis...
>
> Could you please try if the attached change works for you (without your
> patch)?
>
I was just about to send you log output that showed seemingly random values
in glyph::frame. You beat me to it.
This patch appears to fix the problem for me, thank you.
Is this the only place that they need to be initialized? Was it more than
glyph::frame that was uninitialized (and was that problematic)?
For my own edification, while logging GLYPH_EQUAL_P, I noticed that it's
invoked frequently for windows/buffers that are not visible. As in, while a
hidden vterm buffer is accumulating log output and I only have a single
stationary buffer visible, I see a flood of log messages. Is this expected?
It may very well be, I just don't know much about the rendering pipeline.
Thanks,
Aaron
--000000000000c6171106307acbf3
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla=
ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color=
:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)">On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 12:25 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann </sp=
an><span dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@gmail.=
com" target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN</a>></span><s=
pan style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)"> wrote:<=
/span></div></div></div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><d=
iv class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:=
0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail=
_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><p class=3D"">Aaron Jensen <<a target=
=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN=
m" class=3D"">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>> writes:
<br></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D"">
Hi,
<br></p><p class=3D"">
I've narrowed it down to the addition to frame in the glyph
comparison. As far as I can tell, the attached patch removes the
flickering for me. I saw the cursor blink once, but I couldn't
reproduce that and I couldn't get it to do it again.
<br></p><p class=3D"">
The patch is not suitable for applying to master as it certainly
breaks something int he tty child frame code, but hopefully it gives
you an idea of what the problem might be. I'm going to experiment with
accounting for the NULL frame in the space glyph and see if that
helps.
<br></p></blockquote><p class=3D"">
Thanks Aaron, that was very helpful. I'm pretty sure it gave me right
idea, namely... This in adjust_glyph_matrix
<br></p><p class=3D"">
dispnew.c:
<br>
505 while (row < end)
<br>
506 {
<br>
507 row->glyphs[LEFT_MARGIN_AREA] =3D
508 xnrealloc (row->glyphs[LEFT_MARGIN_AREA],
509 dim.width, sizeof (struct glyph));
</p><p class=3D"">
means that glyphs in window-system windows are not zeroed. Which in turn
means that glyph::frame is not guaranteed to be NULL initially. And
because I falsely assumed that to be the case, I didn't change the code
producing glyphs for window-systems to set glyph::frame, which isn't
needed or used on window-systems. And in the end, the glyph comparisons
can fail.
<br></p><p class=3D"">
Or so is the hypothesis...
<br></p><p class=3D"">
Could you please try if the attached change works for you (without your
patch)?<br></p></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div><div><div><=
br></div><div><br></div><div>I was just about to send you log output that s=
howed seemingly random values in glyph::frame. You beat me to it. <br></div=
><div><br></div><div>This patch appears to fix the problem for me, thank yo=
u. <br></div><div><br></div><div>Is this the only place that they need to b=
e initialized? Was it more than glyph::frame that was uninitialized (and wa=
s that problematic)?=C2=A0<br></div><div><br></div><div>For my own edificat=
ion, while logging=C2=A0GLYPH_EQUAL_P, I noticed that it's invoked freq=
uently for windows/buffers that are not visible. As in, while a hidden vter=
m buffer is accumulating log output and I only have a single stationary buf=
fer visible, I see a flood of log messages. Is this expected? It may very w=
ell be, I just don't know much about the rendering pipeline.<br></div><=
div><br></div><div>Thanks,<br></div><div><br></div><div>Aaron<br></div></di=
v><div><br></div></div><div></div></div></body></html>
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bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b737:9500:25f2:4de7:973e:1333]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-395c7df33d7sm13138739f8f.17.2025.03.16.12.35.51 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 16 Mar 2025 12:35:51 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48y=7WqyDEuP9agx4S5jWN6pVCe=xZt5jJVLYsJQA923wg@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48z7mxEpt9Zn6WjXTuD6nikcBAW=2fKqpk3Nt=g=09vukA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48y=7WqyDEuP9agx4S5jWN6pVCe=xZt5jJVLYsJQA923wg@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 20:35:50 +0100 Message-ID: <m2bju07oq1.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > Actually, while I don't fully understand the code, it seems suspect > to me that there is a global `space_glyph` glyph struct that gets > initialized with a NULL frame but the frame is mutated over time. I > wonder if my not removing the frame check inside of > CHAR_GLYPH_SPACE_P is why I saw the cursor flicker once. > > I was mistaken here, I believe. It's not mutated over time =E2=80=94 I'm = just > rusty on C and I misread some code. And the redisplay code is pretty complicated, I must admit. Much of which is due to the slowness of mid-90s computers and pressing something with acceptable performance out of that =F0=9F=A4=B7.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS
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--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/plain
Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes:
> Hi,
>
> I've narrowed it down to the addition to frame in the glyph
> comparison. As far as I can tell, the attached patch removes the
> flickering for me. I saw the cursor blink once, but I couldn't
> reproduce that and I couldn't get it to do it again.
>
> The patch is not suitable for applying to master as it certainly
> breaks something int he tty child frame code, but hopefully it gives
> you an idea of what the problem might be. I'm going to experiment with
> accounting for the NULL frame in the space glyph and see if that
> helps.
Thanks Aaron, that was very helpful. I'm pretty sure it gave me right
idea, namely... This in adjust_glyph_matrix
dispnew.c:
505 while (row < end)
506 {
507 row->glyphs[LEFT_MARGIN_AREA] =
508 xnrealloc (row->glyphs[LEFT_MARGIN_AREA],
509 dim.width, sizeof (struct glyph));
means that glyphs in window-system windows are not zeroed. Which in turn
means that glyph::frame is not guaranteed to be NULL initially. And
because I falsely assumed that to be the case, I didn't change the code
producing glyphs for window-systems to set glyph::frame, which isn't
needed or used on window-systems. And in the end, the glyph comparisons
can fail.
Or so is the hypothesis...
Could you please try if the attached change works for you (without your
patch)?
--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/x-patch
Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=adjust.diff
diff --git a/src/dispnew.c b/src/dispnew.c
index 69b29aeac16..0a404d9e37f 100644
--- a/src/dispnew.c
+++ b/src/dispnew.c
@@ -504,9 +504,11 @@ adjust_glyph_matrix (struct window *w, struct glyph_matrix *matrix, int x, int y
while (row < end)
{
- row->glyphs[LEFT_MARGIN_AREA] =
- xnrealloc (row->glyphs[LEFT_MARGIN_AREA],
- dim.width, sizeof (struct glyph));
+ row->glyphs[LEFT_MARGIN_AREA]
+ = xnrealloc (row->glyphs[LEFT_MARGIN_AREA], dim.width,
+ sizeof (struct glyph));
+ memset (row->glyphs[LEFT_MARGIN_AREA], 0,
+ dim.width * sizeof (struct glyph));
/* The mode line, if displayed, never has marginal areas. */
if ((row == matrix->rows + dim.height - 1
&& !(w && window_wants_mode_line (w)))
--=-=-=--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Sun, 16 Mar 2025 10:44:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 649336022844 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 16 Mar 2025 17:44:16 +0000 Received: from 649336022844 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 16 Mar 2025 17:44:16 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Superhuman Desktop (2025-03-14T21:48:50Z) In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48z7mxEpt9Zn6WjXTuD6nikcBAW=2fKqpk3Nt=g=09vukA@HIDDEN> X-Superhuman-ID: m8bxd30a.789b8da2-49ac-4e8d-8dbb-1885a34a5923 X-Superhuman-Draft-ID: draft0003049d9cf7d6b0 References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48z7mxEpt9Zn6WjXTuD6nikcBAW=2fKqpk3Nt=g=09vukA@HIDDEN> From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 17:44:16 +0000 X-Gm-Features: AQ5f1Jrd-fJ-ktbt8-mMw2IvxUN0_P8Zm3WZM-9_ZsW0i3m1QzROBifXKmxC-QU Message-ID: <CAHyO48y=7WqyDEuP9agx4S5jWN6pVCe=xZt5jJVLYsJQA923wg@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS To: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000079419f0630793832" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --00000000000079419f0630793832 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Aaron On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 10:19 AM, Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> wrote: > On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 10:15 AM, Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> I've narrowed it down to the addition to frame in the glyph comparison. >> As far as I can tell, the attached patch removes the flickering for me. = I >> saw the cursor blink once, but I couldn't reproduce that and I couldn't = get >> it to do it again. >> >> The patch is not suitable for applying to master as it certainly breaks >> something int he tty child frame code, but hopefully it gives you an ide= a >> of what the problem might be. I'm going to experiment with accounting fo= r >> the NULL frame in the space glyph and see if that helps. >> >> Aaron >> > > Actually, while I don't fully understand the code, it seems suspect to me > that there is a global `space_glyph` glyph struct that gets initialized > with a NULL frame but the frame is mutated over time. I wonder if my not > removing the frame check inside of CHAR_GLYPH_SPACE_P is why I saw the > cursor flicker once. > I was mistaken here, I believe. It's not mutated over time =E2=80=94 I'm ju= st rusty on C and I misread some code. Aaron > >> On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 2:00 AM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@gmai= l.com> >> wrote: >> >>> Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: >>> >>> One other thing, it may be related to tab-bar mode. It seems to be >>> connected to when I switch tabs =E2=80=94 one tab has a vterm buffer sc= rolling >>> output and the other just has a grep output, for example. If I don't ge= t >>> the flicker in the grep output, I can switch back and forth between the= two >>> tabs a couple times and I'll start to get it. >>> >>> Doesn't ring a bell, I'm afraid. Tab bar, AFAIU it, is "just playing >>> with window configurations". Why that would lead to flickering, I can't >>> imagine ATM. >>> >> --00000000000079419f0630793832 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla= ss=3D""><div class=3D""><br></div></div><br><div class=3D"sh-signature"><di= v class=3D"gmail_signature"><div class=3D""><br>Aaron</div><br></div></div>= </div><br><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div class=3D"gm= ail_quote">On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 10:19 AM, Aaron Jensen <span dir=3D"ltr"= class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" target=3D"_blank" = class=3D"">aaronjensen@HIDDEN</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class= =3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padd= ing-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div cl= ass=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><d= iv class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,= 0,0.6)" class=3D"">On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 10:15 AM, Aaron Jensen </span><s= pan class=3D"" dir=3D"ltr"><<a class=3D"" href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@gma= il.com" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmai= l.<wbr>com</a>></span><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);colo= r:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)" class=3D""> wrote:</span><br></div></div></div><div clas= s=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockqu= ote style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"= class=3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote= "><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D"">Hi,<br></= div><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">I've narrowed it down to = the addition to frame in the glyph comparison. As far as I can tell, the at= tached patch removes the flickering for me. I saw the cursor blink once, bu= t I couldn't reproduce that and I couldn't get it to do it again.<b= r></div><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">The patch is not suitable= for applying to master as it certainly breaks something int he tty=C2=A0ch= ild frame code, but hopefully it gives you an idea of what the problem migh= t be. I'm going=C2=A0to experiment with accounting for the NULL frame i= n the space glyph and see if that helps.<br></div></div><div class=3D""><br= ></div><div class=3D"gmail_signature"><div class=3D"">Aaron<br></div></div>= </div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div><div class=3D"= "><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">Actually, while I don't ful= ly=C2=A0understand the code, it seems suspect to me that there is a global = `space_glyph` glyph struct that gets initialized with a NULL frame but the = frame is mutated over time. I wonder if my not removing the frame check ins= ide of CHAR_GLYPH_SPACE_P is why I saw the cursor flicker once.<br></div></= div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div><div><div>= <br></div><div><br></div><div>I was mistaken here, I believe. It's not = mutated over time =E2=80=94 I'm just rusty on C and I misread some code= .<br></div><div><br></div><div>Aaron</div><div><br></div></div><div class= =3D""><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_= quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-= left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class= =3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class= =3D""><br></div></div><div class=3D""><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div= class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8= ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote"><div = class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D""><br><div c= lass=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 2:00 AM, Gerd = M=C3=B6llmann <span class=3D"" dir=3D"ltr"><<a class=3D"" rel=3D"noopene= r noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN" target=3D"_blank">ge= rd.<wbr>moellmann@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote = class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid= ;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><p= class=3D"">Aaron Jensen <<a rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:= aaronjensen@HIDDEN" class=3D"" target=3D"_blank">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.= <wbr>com</a>> writes: <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> One other thing, it may be related to tab-bar mode. It seems to be connected to when I switch tabs =E2=80=94 one tab has a vterm buffer scroll= ing output and the other just has a grep output, for example. If I don't get the flicker in the grep output, I can switch back and forth between the two tabs a couple times and I'll start to get it. <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> Doesn't ring a bell, I'm afraid. Tab bar, AFAIU it, is "just p= laying with window configurations". Why that would lead to flickering, I can't imagine ATM.<br></p></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div></div>= </blockquote></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><= /div></div></div></div><div><br></div></div><div></div></div></body></html> --00000000000079419f0630793832--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Sun, 16 Mar 2025 10:19:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 649336022844 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 16 Mar 2025 17:19:47 +0000 Received: from 649336022844 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 16 Mar 2025 17:19:47 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Superhuman-ID: m8bwi0mo.bc27e7c3-cd33-4a0b-b3a8-fd05dc49d18b In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> X-Mailer: Superhuman Desktop (2025-03-14T21:48:50Z) X-Superhuman-Draft-ID: draft00033e9aab6e8a1e References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 17:19:47 +0000 X-Gm-Features: AQ5f1JrArfeAueWSP5zTc1Ip98Jh6IoMvlNW6UjVOXaGhKPSK57UJeNAkDKlfIQ Message-ID: <CAHyO48z7mxEpt9Zn6WjXTuD6nikcBAW=2fKqpk3Nt=g=09vukA@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS To: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000ef9223063078e0ef" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --000000000000ef9223063078e0ef Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 10:15 AM, Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> wrote: > Hi, > > I've narrowed it down to the addition to frame in the glyph comparison. A= s > far as I can tell, the attached patch removes the flickering for me. I sa= w > the cursor blink once, but I couldn't reproduce that and I couldn't get i= t > to do it again. > > The patch is not suitable for applying to master as it certainly breaks > something int he tty child frame code, but hopefully it gives you an idea > of what the problem might be. I'm going to experiment with accounting for > the NULL frame in the space glyph and see if that helps. > > Aaron > Actually, while I don't fully understand the code, it seems suspect to me that there is a global `space_glyph` glyph struct that gets initialized with a NULL frame but the frame is mutated over time. I wonder if my not removing the frame check inside of CHAR_GLYPH_SPACE_P is why I saw the cursor flicker once. > On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 2:00 AM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@gmail= .com> > wrote: > >> Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: >> >> One other thing, it may be related to tab-bar mode. It seems to be >> connected to when I switch tabs =E2=80=94 one tab has a vterm buffer scr= olling >> output and the other just has a grep output, for example. If I don't get >> the flicker in the grep output, I can switch back and forth between the = two >> tabs a couple times and I'll start to get it. >> >> Doesn't ring a bell, I'm afraid. Tab bar, AFAIU it, is "just playing wit= h >> window configurations". Why that would lead to flickering, I can't imagi= ne >> ATM. >> > --000000000000ef9223063078e0ef Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla= ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color= :rgba(0,0,0,0.6)">On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 10:15 AM, Aaron Jensen </span><sp= an dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" targ= et=3D"_blank" class=3D"">aaronjensen@HIDDEN</a>></span><span style=3D= "background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)"> wrote:</span></div>= </div></div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div class=3D"= gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;b= order-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div= class=3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div= class=3D"">Hi,<br></div><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">I've= narrowed it down to the addition to frame in the glyph comparison. As far = as I can tell, the attached patch removes the flickering for me. I saw the = cursor blink once, but I couldn't reproduce that and I couldn't get= it to do it again.<br></div><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">The = patch is not suitable for applying to master as it certainly breaks somethi= ng int he tty=C2=A0child frame code, but hopefully it gives you an idea of = what the problem might be. I'm going=C2=A0to experiment with accounting= for the NULL frame in the space glyph and see if that helps.<br></div></di= v><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_signature"><div class=3D"">= Aaron<br></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div= ></div><div><div><br></div><div>Actually, while I don't fully=C2=A0unde= rstand the code, it seems suspect to me that there is a global `space_glyph= ` glyph struct that gets initialized with a NULL frame but the frame is mut= ated over time. I wonder if my not removing the frame check inside of CHAR_= GLYPH_SPACE_P is why I saw the cursor flicker once.</div><div><br></div></d= iv><div class=3D""><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div cl= ass=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0= .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extr= a"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D""><br><div class=3D""><div clas= s=3D"gmail_quote">On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 2:00 AM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <span= dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN" tar= get=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" class=3D"">gerd.<wbr>moellmann@<= wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote style=3D"margin:0 0= 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote">= <div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><p class=3D"">Aaron J= ensen <<a class=3D"" href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" rel=3D"noopen= er noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>> wr= ites: <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> One other thing, it may be related to tab-bar mode. It seems to be connected to when I switch tabs =E2=80=94 one tab has a vterm buffer scroll= ing output and the other just has a grep output, for example. If I don't get the flicker in the grep output, I can switch back and forth between the two tabs a couple times and I'll start to get it. <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> Doesn't ring a bell, I'm afraid. Tab bar, AFAIU it, is "just p= laying with window configurations". Why that would lead to flickering, I can't imagine ATM.<br></p></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div></div>= </blockquote></div></div></div></div><div><br></div></div><div></div></div>= </body></html> --000000000000ef9223063078e0ef--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Sun, 16 Mar 2025 10:15:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 649336022844 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 16 Mar 2025 10:15:35 -0700 Received: from 649336022844 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 16 Mar 2025 10:15:35 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Superhuman-ID: m8bwc6rn.30611466-9ebe-4f40-baf4-a4793e5568a5 References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Mailer: Superhuman Desktop (2025-03-14T21:48:50Z) X-Superhuman-Draft-ID: draft00f7a6948389c0c1 In-Reply-To: <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 10:15:35 -0700 X-Gm-Features: AQ5f1JpHRdN0qRRBsVebYhfdTCwYX3B4jsehXjn_bM-1WkrFdWhcx4C-Zd6lWHY Message-ID: <CAHyO48wjGcrGA-55_J4kLU99HJ+sn1w1UP9AfhZBVkuXXrvqYw@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS To: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="000000000000e97b70063078d14d" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --000000000000e97b70063078d14d Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000e97b6f063078d14b" --000000000000e97b6f063078d14b Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, I've narrowed it down to the addition to frame in the glyph comparison. As far as I can tell, the attached patch removes the flickering for me. I saw the cursor blink once, but I couldn't reproduce that and I couldn't get it to do it again. The patch is not suitable for applying to master as it certainly breaks something int he tty child frame code, but hopefully it gives you an idea of what the problem might be. I'm going to experiment with accounting for the NULL frame in the space glyph and see if that helps. Aaron On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 2:00 AM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN= om> wrote: > Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > > One other thing, it may be related to tab-bar mode. It seems to be > connected to when I switch tabs =E2=80=94 one tab has a vterm buffer scro= lling > output and the other just has a grep output, for example. If I don't get > the flicker in the grep output, I can switch back and forth between the t= wo > tabs a couple times and I'll start to get it. > > Doesn't ring a bell, I'm afraid. Tab bar, AFAIU it, is "just playing with > window configurations". Why that would lead to flickering, I can't imagin= e > ATM. > --000000000000e97b6f063078d14b Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div><div class=3D"">Hi,<br></div><div c= lass=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">I've narrowed it down to the additi= on to frame in the glyph comparison. As far as I can tell, the attached pat= ch removes the flickering for me. I saw the cursor blink once, but I couldn= 't reproduce that and I couldn't get it to do it again.<br></div><d= iv class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">The patch is not suitable for apply= ing to master as it certainly breaks something int he tty=C2=A0child frame = code, but hopefully it gives you an idea of what the problem might be. I= 9;m going=C2=A0to experiment with accounting for the NULL frame in the spac= e glyph and see if that helps.</div></div><div></div><br><div class=3D"gmai= l_signature"><div><br>Aaron</div><br></div></div><br><div><div class=3D"gma= il_quote">On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 2:00 AM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <span dir=3D"= ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN" target=3D"_blank">gerd= .moellmann@HIDDEN</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_qu= ote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex= "><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote sh-color-black sh-co= lor"><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color">Aaron Jensen <<a target=3D"_bl= ank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" clas= s=3D"sh-color-blue sh-color">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>> writes= : </p><blockquote class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"><p class=3D"sh-color-blac= k sh-color"> One other thing, it may be related to tab-bar mode. It seems to be connected to when I switch tabs =E2=80=94 one tab has a vterm buffer scroll= ing output and the other just has a grep output, for example. If I don't get the flicker in the grep output, I can switch back and forth between the two tabs a couple times and I'll start to get it. </p></blockquote><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"> Doesn't ring a bell, I'm afraid. Tab bar, AFAIU it, is "just p= laying with window configurations". Why that would lead to flickering, I can't imagine ATM.</p></div></div></blockquote></div></div><br></div></body></htm= l> --000000000000e97b6f063078d14b-- --000000000000e97b70063078d14d Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="0001-Eliminate-flicker-on-macOS-do-not-apply.patch" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="0001-Eliminate-flicker-on-macOS-do-not-apply.patch" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 X-Attachment-Id: 89ad19825fbda509_0.1 RnJvbSAyN2Q3ZmIxMGY0ZDMxNmRlYWVmZWM5YTUyOTM0MDRkNzg5YTI2ZTM0IE1vbiBTZXAgMTcg MDA6MDA6MDAgMjAwMQpGcm9tOiBBYXJvbiBKZW5zZW4gPGFhcm9uamVuc2VuQGdtYWlsLmNvbT4K RGF0ZTogU3VuLCAxNiBNYXIgMjAyNSAxMDoxMTozNCAtMDcwMApTdWJqZWN0OiBbUEFUQ0hdIEVs aW1pbmF0ZSBmbGlja2VyIG9uIG1hY09TIChkbyBub3QgYXBwbHkpCgotLS0KIHNyYy9kaXNwZXh0 ZXJuLmggfCA0ICsrLS0KIDEgZmlsZSBjaGFuZ2VkLCAyIGluc2VydGlvbnMoKyksIDIgZGVsZXRp b25zKC0pCgpkaWZmIC0tZ2l0IGEvc3JjL2Rpc3BleHRlcm4uaCBiL3NyYy9kaXNwZXh0ZXJuLmgK aW5kZXggYmQ0ODAwNWI4M2YuLjA4NGE1NGZmMDYyIDEwMDY0NAotLS0gYS9zcmMvZGlzcGV4dGVy bi5oCisrKyBiL3NyYy9kaXNwZXh0ZXJuLmgKQEAgLTY2MSw3ICs2NjEsNyBAQCAjZGVmaW5lIEdM WVBIX0VRVUFMX1AoWCwgWSkJCQkJCVwKICAgICAgICYmIChYKS0+dS52YWwgPT0gKFkpLT51LnZh bAkJCQlcCiAgICAgICAmJiBHTFlQSF9TTElDRV9FUVVBTF9QIChYLCBZKQkJCQlcCiAgICAgICAm JiAoWCktPmZhY2VfaWQgPT0gKFkpLT5mYWNlX2lkCQkJCVwKLSAgICAgICYmIChYKS0+ZnJhbWUg PT0gKFkpLT5mcmFtZQkJCQlcCisgICAgICAvKiAmJiAoWCktPmZyYW1lID09IChZKS0+ZnJhbWUJ Ki8gICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgXAogICAgICAgJiYgKFgpLT5wYWRkaW5nX3AgPT0gKFkp LT5wYWRkaW5nX3AJCQlcCiAgICAgICAmJiAoWCktPmxlZnRfYm94X2xpbmVfcCA9PSAoWSktPmxl ZnRfYm94X2xpbmVfcAkJXAogICAgICAgJiYgKFgpLT5yaWdodF9ib3hfbGluZV9wID09IChZKS0+ cmlnaHRfYm94X2xpbmVfcAkJXApAQCAtNjczLDcgKzY3Myw3IEBAICNkZWZpbmUgR0xZUEhfRVFV QUxfUChYLCBZKQkJCQkJXAogI2RlZmluZSBHTFlQSF9DSEFSX0FORF9GQUNFX0VRVUFMX1AoWCwg WSkJXAogICAoKFgpLT51LmNoID09IChZKS0+dS5jaAkJCVwKICAgICYmIChYKS0+ZmFjZV9pZCA9 PSAoWSktPmZhY2VfaWQJCVwKLSAgICYmIChYKS0+ZnJhbWUgPT0gKFkpLT5mcmFtZQkJCVwKKyAg IC8qICYmIChYKS0+ZnJhbWUgPT0gKFkpLT5mcmFtZSovICAgICAgICAgICAgIFwKICAgICYmIChY KS0+cGFkZGluZ19wID09IChZKS0+cGFkZGluZ19wKQogCiAvKiBGaWxsIGEgY2hhcmFjdGVyIGds eXBoIEdMWVBILiAgQ09ERSwgRkFDRV9JRCwgUEFERElOR19QIGNvcnJlc3BvbmQKLS0gCjIuNDgu MQoK --000000000000e97b70063078d14d--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Flickering on macOS To: Ship Mints <shipmints@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000008d0b70630785fae" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>, Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --00000000000008d0b70630785fae Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 4:49 AM, Ship Mints <shipmints@HIDDEN> wrote: > On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 2:05=E2=80=AFAM Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN= om> > wrote: > >> On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:43 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@gmai= l.com> >> wrote: >> >>> Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: >>> >>> Adding Gerd M=C3=B6llmann. >>> >>> The flicker appears to have been introduced by the work done in >>> 414de92a562 >>> >>> Initial child frames based on master (Mon Oct 21 18:32:04 2024 +0200, 5 >>> months ago) <Gerd M=C3=B6llmann> >>> >>> It's a fairly large change set, so I don't know yet what might be >>> causing it. I can reproduce it fairly consistently using my own setup, = but >>> I don't know how to narrow it down to something from Emacs -Q because i= t >>> appears to be related to CPU utilization and/or rapid updating of buffe= rs >>> that are not currently visible. >>> >>> Aaron >>> >>> On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:49 AM, Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> >>> wrote: >>> >>> Here's a video clip: https://share.cleanshot.com/x8zWLgYf >>> >>> It seems to happen more often when there is significant load. In this >>> case, I was running an 8 worker web server in a vterm in Emacs and a se= t of >>> 8 parallel UI tests against it. The server was printing log messages at= a >>> rapid rate, but that vterm buffer was not visible. >>> >>> Aaron >>> >>> I'm afraid I have not the slightest idea. >>> >>> 414de92a562 concerns only ttys, AFAICT. I've looked through the commit >>> again right now. The changes to NS code directly are only trivial ones >>> (1 -> true, 0 -> false etc.). So it would have to be something in >>> redisplay_internal or something similar, in code not specific to NS tha= t is >>> used on all window systems, and I don't see a change there that could c= ause >>> something with the symptoms you describe. >>> >>> Adding Alan Third in CC. Maybe he has an idea. >>> >> >> I'll try and eliminate aspects of the patch as best as I can. If this is= , >> in fact, a macOS only issue, then it may be that the particular method o= f >> drawing the windows in macOS is susceptible to some change that was made >> here. No idea what it could be, either. I do see that the NS-specific >> changes appear to be innocuous. >> > > What is your frame-parameter inhibit-double-buffering set to? Have you > tried flip-flopping it to see if that has an impact? > I usually have it set to true, but yes, changing it was the first thing I tried. It seems to reduce the overall impact of the flicker (at least when I tried it again just now), but it still happens even when double buffering is enabled. --00000000000008d0b70630785fae Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla= ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color= :rgba(0,0,0,0.6)">On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 4:49 AM, Ship Mints </span><span = dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:shipmints@HIDDEN" target=3D= "_blank" class=3D"">shipmints@HIDDEN</a>></span><span style=3D"backgr= ound-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)"> wrote:</span></div></div><= /div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_q= uote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-l= eft:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class= =3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote gmai= l_quote_container"><div class=3D"gmail_attr" dir=3D"ltr">On Sun, Mar 16, 20= 25 at 2:05=E2=80=AFAM Aaron Jensen <<a href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@gmail.= com" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" class=3D"">aaronjensen@<= wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote style=3D"margin:0px = 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex" clas= s=3D"gmail_quote"><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div clas= s=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"backg= round-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)" class=3D"">On Sat, Mar 15,= 2025 at 9:43 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann </span><span dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"">&l= t;<a href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noop= ener noreferrer" class=3D"">gerd.<wbr>moellmann@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>>= </span><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)"= class=3D""> wrote:</span><br></div></div></div><div class=3D""><div class= =3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.= 8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex" class=3D"gmail= _quote"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><p class=3D""= >Aaron Jensen <<a href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" rel=3D"noopener = noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a= >> writes: <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> Adding Gerd M=C3=B6llmann. <br></p><p class=3D""> The flicker appears to have been introduced by the work done in 414de92a562 <br></p><p class=3D""> Initial child frames based on master (<span class=3D""><span class=3D"sh-da= te">Mon Oct 21</span></span> 18:32:04 2024 +0200, 5 months ago) <Gerd M= =C3=B6llmann> <br></p><p class=3D""> It's a fairly large change set, so I don't know yet what might be c= ausing it. I can reproduce it fairly consistently using my own setup, but I don't know how to narrow it down to something= from Emacs -Q because it appears to be related to CPU utilization and/or rapid updating of buffers that are not currently vis= ible. <br></p><p class=3D""> Aaron <br></p><p class=3D""> On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:49 AM, Aaron Jensen <<a href=3D"mailto:aaronje= nsen@HIDDEN" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">aa= ronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>> wrote: <br></p><p class=3D""> Here's a video clip: <a href=3D"https://share.cleanshot.com/x8zWLgYf" r= el=3D"noopener noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">https:/<wbr>/<wbr>s= hare.<wbr>cleanshot.<wbr>com/<wbr>x8zWLgYf</a> <br></p><p class=3D""> It seems to happen more often when there is significant load. In this case,= I was running an 8 worker web server in a vterm in Emacs and a set of 8 parallel UI tests against it. The server was = printing log messages at a rapid rate, but that vterm buffer was not visible. <br></p><p class=3D""> Aaron <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> I'm afraid I have not the slightest idea. <br></p><p class=3D""> 414de92a562 concerns only ttys, AFAICT. I've looked through the commit again right now. The changes to NS code directly are only trivial ones <br> (1 -> true, 0 -> false etc.). So it would have to be something in redisplay_internal or something similar, in code not specific to NS that is used on all window systems, and I don't see a change there that coul= d cause something with the symptoms you describe. </p><p class=3D""> Adding Alan Third in CC. Maybe he has an idea.<br></p></div></div></blockqu= ote></div></div></div></div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><br></div><div = class=3D"">I'll try and eliminate aspects of the patch as best as I can= . If this is, in fact, a macOS only issue, then it may be that the particul= ar method of drawing the windows in macOS is susceptible to some change tha= t was made here. No idea what it could be, either. I do see that the NS-spe= cific changes appear to be innocuous.<br></div></div></div></div></div></bl= ockquote><div class=3D""><br></div><div style=3D"font-family:monospace" cla= ss=3D"gmail_default">What is your frame-parameter=C2=A0inhibit-double-buffe= ring set to?=C2=A0 Have you tried flip-flopping it to see if that has an im= pact?<br></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div= ><div><div><br></div><div>I usually have it set to true,=C2=A0 but yes, cha= nging it was the first thing I tried. It seems to reduce the overall impact= of the flicker (at least when I tried it again just now), but it still hap= pens even when double buffering is enabled.</div><div><br></div><div><br></= div></div></div><div></div></div></body></html> --00000000000008d0b70630785fae--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Flickering on macOS To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000002d40170630744357" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>, Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --0000000000002d40170630744357 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at 2:05=E2=80=AFAM Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN= > wrote: > On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:43 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@gmail= .com> > wrote: > >> Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: >> >> Adding Gerd M=C3=B6llmann. >> >> The flicker appears to have been introduced by the work done in >> 414de92a562 >> >> Initial child frames based on master (Mon Oct 21 18:32:04 2024 +0200, 5 >> months ago) <Gerd M=C3=B6llmann> >> >> It's a fairly large change set, so I don't know yet what might be causin= g >> it. I can reproduce it fairly consistently using my own setup, but I don= 't >> know how to narrow it down to something from Emacs -Q because it appears= to >> be related to CPU utilization and/or rapid updating of buffers that are = not >> currently visible. >> >> Aaron >> >> On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:49 AM, Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> >> wrote: >> >> Here's a video clip: https://share.cleanshot.com/x8zWLgYf >> >> It seems to happen more often when there is significant load. In this >> case, I was running an 8 worker web server in a vterm in Emacs and a set= of >> 8 parallel UI tests against it. The server was printing log messages at = a >> rapid rate, but that vterm buffer was not visible. >> >> Aaron >> >> I'm afraid I have not the slightest idea. >> >> 414de92a562 concerns only ttys, AFAICT. I've looked through the commit >> again right now. The changes to NS code directly are only trivial ones >> (1 -> true, 0 -> false etc.). So it would have to be something in >> redisplay_internal or something similar, in code not specific to NS that= is >> used on all window systems, and I don't see a change there that could ca= use >> something with the symptoms you describe. >> >> Adding Alan Third in CC. Maybe he has an idea. >> > > I'll try and eliminate aspects of the patch as best as I can. If this is, > in fact, a macOS only issue, then it may be that the particular method of > drawing the windows in macOS is susceptible to some change that was made > here. No idea what it could be, either. I do see that the NS-specific > changes appear to be innocuous. > What is your frame-parameter inhibit-double-buffering set to? Have you tried flip-flopping it to see if that has an impact? --0000000000002d40170630744357 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"></div><div class=3D"gmail_quote gmail_quo= te_container"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Sun, Mar 16, 2025 at= 2:05=E2=80=AFAM Aaron Jensen <<a href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN">= aaronjensen@HIDDEN</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_qu= ote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,20= 4);padding-left:1ex"><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><span style=3D"back= ground-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)">On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9= :43 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann </span><span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:g= erd.moellmann@HIDDEN" target=3D"_blank">gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN</a>>= </span><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)"= > wrote:</span></div></div></div><div><div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><bloc= kquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:= 1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><di= v class=3D"gmail_quote"><p>Aaron Jensen <<a rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" = href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" target=3D"_blank">aaronjensen@HIDDEN= om</a>> writes: <br></p><blockquote><p> Adding Gerd M=C3=B6llmann. <br></p><p> The flicker appears to have been introduced by the work done in 414de92a562 <br></p><p> Initial child frames based on master (<span>Mon Oct 21</span> 18:32:04 2024= +0200, 5 months ago) <Gerd M=C3=B6llmann> <br></p><p> It's a fairly large change set, so I don't know yet what might be c= ausing it. I can reproduce it fairly consistently using my own setup, but I don't know how to narrow it down to something= from Emacs -Q because it appears to be related to CPU utilization and/or rapid updating of buffers that are not currently vis= ible. <br></p><p> Aaron <br></p><p> On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:49 AM, Aaron Jensen <<a rel=3D"noopener norefe= rrer" href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" target=3D"_blank">aaronjensen@g= mail.com</a>> wrote: <br></p><p> Here's a video clip: <a rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"https://sha= re.cleanshot.com/x8zWLgYf" target=3D"_blank">https://share.cleanshot.com/x8= zWLgYf</a> <br></p><p> It seems to happen more often when there is significant load. In this case,= I was running an 8 worker web server in a vterm in Emacs and a set of 8 parallel UI tests against it. The server was = printing log messages at a rapid rate, but that vterm buffer was not visible. <br></p><p> Aaron <br></p></blockquote><p> I'm afraid I have not the slightest idea. <br></p><p> 414de92a562 concerns only ttys, AFAICT. I've looked through the commit again right now. The changes to NS code directly are only trivial ones <br> (1 -> true, 0 -> false etc.). So it would have to be something in redisplay_internal or something similar, in code not specific to NS that is used on all window systems, and I don't see a change there that coul= d cause something with the symptoms you describe. </p><p> Adding Alan Third in CC. Maybe he has an idea.<br></p></div></div></blockqu= ote></div></div></div></div><div><div><br></div><div>I'll try and elimi= nate aspects of the patch as best as I can. If this is, in fact, a macOS on= ly issue, then it may be that the particular method of drawing the windows = in macOS is susceptible to some change that was made here. No idea what it = could be, either. I do see that the NS-specific changes appear to be innocu= ous.</div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div class=3D= "gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:monospace">What is your frame-paramete= r=C2=A0inhibit-double-buffering set to?=C2=A0 Have you tried flip-flopping = it to see if that has an impact?</div></div></div> --0000000000002d40170630744357--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b737:9500:25f2:4de7:973e:1333]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-395cb40cdc5sm11457155f8f.80.2025.03.16.02.00.19 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 16 Mar 2025 02:00:19 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48xeduxtfUB=rDbikn43Jx0J=nqcPGYPTsew6Mgxuoomgg@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 10:00:18 +0100 Message-ID: <m2sendnye5.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > One other thing, it may be related to tab-bar mode. It seems to be > connected to when I switch tabs =E2=80=94 one tab has a vterm buffer scro= lling > output and the other just has a grep output, for example. If I don't > get the flicker in the grep output, I can switch back and forth > between the two tabs a couple times and I'll start to get it. Doesn't ring a bell, I'm afraid. Tab bar, AFAIU it, is "just playing with window configurations". Why that would lead to flickering, I can't imagine ATM.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b737:9500:25f2:4de7:973e:1333]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-395c83b6e92sm11612879f8f.38.2025.03.16.01.56.43 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 16 Mar 2025 01:56:44 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS (Regression introduced by TTY child frame work) In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48zPPt_9bnr=fc9U+k3CcuvD8qfpymXYjsk7NEz7gFqumA@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <86frjdv6h6.fsf@HIDDEN> <m21puxpird.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48zPPt_9bnr=fc9U+k3CcuvD8qfpymXYjsk7NEz7gFqumA@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 09:56:43 +0100 Message-ID: <m2wmcpnyk4.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > Do you by chance have a version of 414de92a562 that is split into > multiple, sequential commits? The area of most suspicion to me is the > rewrite of update_frame. Kind of unlikely, but who knows. Update_frame splits into 3 branches, one for window-system frames, one for tty frames, and one for the initial frame. NS uses the update_window_frame, which shouldn't have changed. > It's the most significant change, and without going through it part by > part, I can't tell if the non-try changes are mere refactoring or if > they actually have behavioral change. There is the branch scratch/tty-child-frames, which has a few commits, but that's it, I'm afraid. I did the original development in my fork of Emacs on Github, and deleted the branch, when things landed in master.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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It seems to be connected to when I switch tabs =E2=80=94 one tab has a vterm buffer scroll= ing output and the other just has a grep output, for example. If I don't get the flicker in the grep output, I can switch back and forth between the two tabs a couple times and I'll start to get it. Aaron On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 11:03 PM, Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> wrote: > On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:43 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@gmail= .com> > wrote: > > Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > > Adding Gerd M=C3=B6llmann. > > The flicker appears to have been introduced by the work done in > 414de92a562 > > Initial child frames based on master (Mon Oct 21 18:32:04 2024 +0200, 5 > months ago) <Gerd M=C3=B6llmann> > > It's a fairly large change set, so I don't know yet what might be causing > it. I can reproduce it fairly consistently using my own setup, but I don'= t > know how to narrow it down to something from Emacs -Q because it appears = to > be related to CPU utilization and/or rapid updating of buffers that are n= ot > currently visible. > > Aaron > > On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:49 AM, Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > wrote: > > Here's a video clip: https://share.cleanshot.com/x8zWLgYf > > It seems to happen more often when there is significant load. In this > case, I was running an 8 worker web server in a vterm in Emacs and a set = of > 8 parallel UI tests against it. The server was printing log messages at a > rapid rate, but that vterm buffer was not visible. > > Aaron > > I'm afraid I have not the slightest idea. > > 414de92a562 concerns only ttys, AFAICT. I've looked through the commit > again right now. The changes to NS code directly are only trivial ones > (1 -> true, 0 -> false etc.). So it would have to be something in > redisplay_internal or something similar, in code not specific to NS that = is > used on all window systems, and I don't see a change there that could cau= se > something with the symptoms you describe. > > Adding Alan Third in CC. Maybe he has an idea. > > > I'll try and eliminate aspects of the patch as best as I can. If this is, > in fact, a macOS only issue, then it may be that the particular method of > drawing the windows in macOS is susceptible to some change that was made > here. No idea what it could be, either. I do see that the NS-specific > changes appear to be innocuous. > --000000000000cd3b68063070fdcc Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div><div class=3D"">One other thing, it= may be related to tab-bar mode. It seems to be connected to when I switch = tabs =E2=80=94 one tab has a vterm=C2=A0buffer scrolling output and the oth= er just has a grep output, for example. If I don't get the flicker in t= he grep output, I can switch back and=C2=A0forth between the two tabs a cou= ple times and I'll start to get it.</div></div><div></div><br><div clas= s=3D"gmail_signature"><div><br>Aaron</div><br></div></div><br><div><div cla= ss=3D"gmail_quote">On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 11:03 PM, Aaron Jensen <span dir= =3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" target=3D"_blank">aar= onjensen@HIDDEN</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quot= e" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">= <div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote sh-color-black sh-colo= r"><div class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"><div class=3D"sh-color-black sh-c= olor"><div class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"><div class=3D"sh-color-black s= h-color"><div class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"><div class=3D"sh-color-blac= k sh-color"><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,= 0.6)" class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color">On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:43 PM, Ge= rd M=C3=B6llmann </span><span class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color" dir=3D"ltr"= ><<a class=3D"sh-color-blue sh-color" href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@gmai= l.com" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer">gerd.<wbr>moellmann@<w= br>gmail.<wbr>com</a>></span><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,= 0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)" class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"> wrote:</span><= /div></div></div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content sh-color-black sh-color"><= div class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"><div class=3D"gmail_quote sh-color-bl= ack sh-color"><blockquote style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc s= olid;padding-left:1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote sh-color-black sh-color"><div c= lass=3D"gmail_extra sh-color-black sh-color"><div class=3D"gmail_quote sh-c= olor-black sh-color"><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color">Aaron Jensen <= <a class=3D"sh-color-blue sh-color" href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" r= el=3D"noopener noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>co= m</a>> writes: <br></p><blockquote class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"><p class=3D"sh-color-= black sh-color"> Adding Gerd M=C3=B6llmann. <br></p><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"> The flicker appears to have been introduced by the work done in 414de92a562 <br></p><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"> Initial child frames based on master (<span class=3D"sh-date sh-color-black= sh-color">Mon Oct 21</span> 18:32:04 2024 +0200, 5 months ago) <Gerd M= =C3=B6llmann> <br></p><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"> It's a fairly large change set, so I don't know yet what might be c= ausing it. I can reproduce it fairly consistently using my own setup, but I don't know how to narrow it down to something= from Emacs -Q because it appears to be related to CPU utilization and/or rapid updating of buffers that are not currently vis= ible. <br></p><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"> Aaron <br></p><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"> On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:49 AM, Aaron Jensen <<a class=3D"sh-color-blue= sh-color" href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer= " target=3D"_blank">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>> wrote: <br></p><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"> Here's a video clip: <a class=3D"sh-color-blue sh-color" href=3D"https:= //share.cleanshot.com/x8zWLgYf" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" target=3D"_blan= k">https:/<wbr>/<wbr>share.<wbr>cleanshot.<wbr>com/<wbr>x8zWLgYf</a> <br></p><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"> It seems to happen more often when there is significant load. In this case,= I was running an 8 worker web server in a vterm in Emacs and a set of 8 parallel UI tests against it. The server was = printing log messages at a rapid rate, but that vterm buffer was not visible. <br></p><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"> Aaron <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"> I'm afraid I have not the slightest idea. <br></p><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"> 414de92a562 concerns only ttys, AFAICT. I've looked through the commit again right now. The changes to NS code directly are only trivial ones <br> (1 -> true, 0 -> false etc.). So it would have to be something in redisplay_internal or something similar, in code not specific to NS that is used on all window systems, and I don't see a change there that coul= d cause something with the symptoms you describe. </p><p class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"> Adding Alan Third in CC. Maybe he has an idea.<br></p></div></div></blockqu= ote></div></div></div></div><div class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"><div cla= ss=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"><br></div><div class=3D"sh-color-black sh-co= lor">I'll try and eliminate aspects of the patch as best as I can. If t= his is, in fact, a macOS only issue, then it may be that the particular met= hod of drawing the windows in macOS is susceptible to some change that was = made here. No idea what it could be, either. I do see that the NS-specific = changes appear to be innocuous.</div></div></div></div></div></div></blockq= uote></div></div><br></div></body></html> --000000000000cd3b68063070fdcc--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Flickering on macOS (Regression introduced by TTY child frame work) To: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000029c9ec063070e849" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --00000000000029c9ec063070e849 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 11:55 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@gmail.= com> wrote: > Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: > > Cc: gerd@HIDDEN > From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 02:19:32 +0000 > > Adding Gerd M=C3=B6llmann. > > Sub-optimal address; fixed with this message. > > Thanks. This was a case where I actually got Aaron's mail. > > @Aaron: gerd@HIDDEN doesn't work anymore, with 2 exceptions so far, one > being your mail. > Understood, thanks. Do you by chance have a version of 414de92a562 that is split into multiple, sequential commits? The area of most suspicion to me is the rewrite of update_frame. It's the most significant change, and without going through it part by part, I can't tell if the non-try changes are mere refactoring or if they actually have behavioral change. --00000000000029c9ec063070e849 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla= ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color= :rgba(0,0,0,0.6)">On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 11:55 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann </sp= an><span dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@gmail.= com" target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN</a>></span><s= pan style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)"> wrote:<= /span></div></div></div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><d= iv class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:= 0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail= _extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><p class=3D"">Eli Zaretskii <<a targe= t=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN" class= =3D"">eliz@<wbr>gnu.<wbr>org</a>> writes: <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> Cc: <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:gerd@gn= u.org" class=3D"">gerd@<wbr>gnu.<wbr>org</a> <br> From: Aaron Jensen <<a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" hre= f=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" class=3D"">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>c= om</a>> <br> Date: <span class=3D"sh-date">Sun</span>, <span class=3D"sh-date">16 Mar 20= 25</span> 02:19:32 +0000 </p><p class=3D""> Adding Gerd M=C3=B6llmann. <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> Sub-optimal address; fixed with this message. <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> Thanks. This was a case where I actually got Aaron's mail. <br></p><p class=3D""> @Aaron: <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:ger= d@HIDDEN" class=3D"">gerd@<wbr>gnu.<wbr>org</a> doesn't work anymore, = with 2 exceptions so far, one being your mail.<br></p></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div><d= iv><div><br></div><div>Understood, thanks.<br></div><div><br></div><div>Do = you by chance have a version of=C2=A0414de92a562 that is split into multipl= e, sequential commits? The area of most suspicion to me is the rewrite of u= pdate_frame. It's the most significant change, and without going throug= h it part by part, I can't tell if the non-try=C2=A0changes are mere re= factoring=C2=A0or if they actually have behavioral change.<br></div><div><b= r></div><div><br></div></div><div><br></div></div><div></div></div></body><= /html> --00000000000029c9ec063070e849--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b737:9500:25f2:4de7:973e:1333]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-395cb40cdd0sm11203169f8f.77.2025.03.15.23.55.02 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sat, 15 Mar 2025 23:55:04 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS (Regression introduced by TTY child frame work) In-Reply-To: <86frjdv6h6.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <86frjdv6h6.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 07:55:02 +0100 Message-ID: <m21puxpird.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: >> Cc: gerd@HIDDEN >> From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> >> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 02:19:32 +0000 >>=20 >> Adding Gerd M=C3=B6llmann. > > Sub-optimal address; fixed with this message. Thanks. This was a case where I actually got Aaron's mail. @Aaron: gerd@HIDDEN doesn't work anymore, with 2 exceptions so far, one being your mail.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 77039) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 Mar 2025 06:24:00 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Mar 16 02:24:00 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45022 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tthPk-0003FD-BX for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Mar 2025 02:24:00 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:58634) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tthPh-0003Ej-Vs for 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 16 Mar 2025 02:23:58 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tthPc-0006fY-GK; Sun, 16 Mar 2025 02:23:52 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=yAqMo5GBzzVRTGEuJFXgGdbDgBrFqnxSSpZsq0KUyC8=; b=UXntS/8WSxib5xeh2w/S s4xgZ8aS/DVMpIBPP8y9TKBM5aM+LfdT6W0amz4Av3zOIqGzac4fdOGuNQ/HTvKwzw29pnKIER2WB QgMWuEp31EVSLu5HfVSzIPTkcWbEGab+J92KQQ9KbP4/nIbr4QL/TSVhJZQ6xcSgPGo5ORTEFWTgs itWwJ5LouryEO58hpIpDc0dqPEzFPLQg8QZIfdM9HydowpX+lgUeeSxiah9PalpVzYvYtHY5MbsXa LDCqtDBPYBhJMVyLwKTZaCzLOoUP+0fAOlKodnm8dwCTMyg6xxeH7kr4MKU356l0btUfbP6zbtcc/ l1/RL8SmHf8GHw==; Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 08:23:49 +0200 Message-Id: <86frjdv6h6.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>, =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> (message from Aaron Jensen on Sun, 16 Mar 2025 02:19:32 +0000) Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS (Regression introduced by TTY child frame work) References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Cc: gerd@HIDDEN > From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 02:19:32 +0000 > > Adding Gerd Möllmann. Sub-optimal address; fixed with this message. > The flicker appears to have been introduced by the work done in 414de92a562 > > Initial child frames based on master (Mon Oct 21 18:32:04 2024 +0200, 5 months ago) <Gerd Möllmann> > > It's a fairly large change set, so I don't know yet what might be causing it. I can reproduce it fairly consistently > using my own setup, but I don't know how to narrow it down to something from Emacs -Q because it appears > to be related to CPU utilization and/or rapid updating of buffers that are not currently visible. > > Aaron > > On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:49 AM, Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> wrote: > > Here's a video clip: https://share.cleanshot.com/x8zWLgYf > > It seems to happen more often when there is significant load. In this case, I was running an 8 worker > web server in a vterm in Emacs and a set of 8 parallel UI tests against it. The server was printing log > messages at a rapid rate, but that vterm buffer was not visible. > > Aaron
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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Sat, 15 Mar 2025 23:03:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 649336022844 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 16 Mar 2025 06:03:52 +0000 Received: from 649336022844 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Sun, 16 Mar 2025 06:03:52 +0000 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Superhuman-ID: m8b8cdjw.f6345977-42b5-4f62-b9a8-108f946c5114 X-Superhuman-Draft-ID: draft00e1b085670852da References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> X-Mailer: Superhuman Desktop (2025-03-14T21:48:50Z) In-Reply-To: <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 06:03:52 +0000 X-Gm-Features: AQ5f1JpA6TZOSEXGt7JYym80POZe8oFitjotC3la3nPP-U0MMIVqflyZ_H6BnYM Message-ID: <CAHyO48yk9C_ONs3ocxjBeaOqEeUazvbkEMBxEFHW4oF1qLfSYA@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS To: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000add3ea06306f6faf" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --000000000000add3ea06306f6faf Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:43 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN= om> wrote: > Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > > Adding Gerd M=C3=B6llmann. > > The flicker appears to have been introduced by the work done in > 414de92a562 > > Initial child frames based on master (Mon Oct 21 18:32:04 2024 +0200, 5 > months ago) <Gerd M=C3=B6llmann> > > It's a fairly large change set, so I don't know yet what might be causing > it. I can reproduce it fairly consistently using my own setup, but I don'= t > know how to narrow it down to something from Emacs -Q because it appears = to > be related to CPU utilization and/or rapid updating of buffers that are n= ot > currently visible. > > Aaron > > On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:49 AM, Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> > wrote: > > Here's a video clip: https://share.cleanshot.com/x8zWLgYf > > It seems to happen more often when there is significant load. In this > case, I was running an 8 worker web server in a vterm in Emacs and a set = of > 8 parallel UI tests against it. The server was printing log messages at a > rapid rate, but that vterm buffer was not visible. > > Aaron > > I'm afraid I have not the slightest idea. > > 414de92a562 concerns only ttys, AFAICT. I've looked through the commit > again right now. The changes to NS code directly are only trivial ones > (1 -> true, 0 -> false etc.). So it would have to be something in > redisplay_internal or something similar, in code not specific to NS that = is > used on all window systems, and I don't see a change there that could cau= se > something with the symptoms you describe. > > Adding Alan Third in CC. Maybe he has an idea. > I'll try and eliminate aspects of the patch as best as I can. If this is, in fact, a macOS only issue, then it may be that the particular method of drawing the windows in macOS is susceptible to some change that was made here. No idea what it could be, either. I do see that the NS-specific changes appear to be innocuous. --000000000000add3ea06306f6faf Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div cla= ss=3D""><div class=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color= :rgba(0,0,0,0.6)">On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:43 PM, Gerd M=C3=B6llmann </spa= n><span dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><<a href=3D"mailto:gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN= om" target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN</a>></span><sp= an style=3D"background-color:rgba(0,0,0,0);color:rgba(0,0,0,0.6)"> wrote:</= span></div></div></div><div class=3D"sh-quoted-content"><div class=3D""><di= v class=3D"gmail_quote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0= 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_= extra"><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><p class=3D"">Aaron Jensen <<a target= =3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN= m" class=3D"">aaronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>> writes: <br></p><blockquote class=3D""><p class=3D""> Adding Gerd M=C3=B6llmann. <br></p><p class=3D""> The flicker appears to have been introduced by the work done in 414de92a562 <br></p><p class=3D""> Initial child frames based on master (<span class=3D"sh-date">Mon Oct 21</s= pan> 18:32:04 2024 +0200, 5 months ago) <Gerd M=C3=B6llmann> <br></p><p class=3D""> It's a fairly large change set, so I don't know yet what might be c= ausing it. I can reproduce it fairly consistently using my own setup, but I don't know how to narrow it down to something= from Emacs -Q because it appears to be related to CPU utilization and/or rapid updating of buffers that are not currently vis= ible. <br></p><p class=3D""> Aaron <br></p><p class=3D""> On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:49 AM, Aaron Jensen <<a target=3D"_blank" rel= =3D"noopener noreferrer" href=3D"mailto:aaronjensen@HIDDEN" class=3D"">a= aronjensen@<wbr>gmail.<wbr>com</a>> wrote: <br></p><p class=3D""> Here's a video clip: <a target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" h= ref=3D"https://share.cleanshot.com/x8zWLgYf" class=3D"">https:/<wbr>/<wbr>s= hare.<wbr>cleanshot.<wbr>com/<wbr>x8zWLgYf</a> <br></p><p class=3D""> It seems to happen more often when there is significant load. In this case,= I was running an 8 worker web server in a vterm in Emacs and a set of 8 parallel UI tests against it. The server was = printing log messages at a rapid rate, but that vterm buffer was not visible. <br></p><p class=3D""> Aaron <br></p></blockquote><p class=3D""> I'm afraid I have not the slightest idea. <br></p><p class=3D""> 414de92a562 concerns only ttys, AFAICT. I've looked through the commit again right now. The changes to NS code directly are only trivial ones <br> (1 -> true, 0 -> false etc.). So it would have to be something in redisplay_internal or something similar, in code not specific to NS that is used on all window systems, and I don't see a change there that coul= d cause something with the symptoms you describe. </p><p class=3D""> Adding Alan Third in CC. Maybe he has an idea.<br></p></div></div></blockqu= ote></div></div></div></div><div><div><br></div><div>I'll try and elimi= nate aspects of the patch as best as I can. If this is, in fact, a macOS on= ly issue, then it may be that the particular method of drawing the windows = in macOS is susceptible to some change that was made here. No idea what it = could be, either. I do see that the NS-specific changes appear to be innocu= ous.<br></div><div><br></div></div><div><br></div></div><div></div></div></= body></html> --000000000000add3ea06306f6faf--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[2003:e0:b737:9500:25f2:4de7:973e:1333]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id ffacd0b85a97d-395cb40cdc5sm10958713f8f.80.2025.03.15.21.43.25 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sat, 15 Mar 2025 21:43:26 -0700 (PDT) From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN> To: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#77039: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS In-Reply-To: <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> References: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> <CAHyO48wM9VYXfSdL4CCyqj8y-v=KsE8_yPX6jJ3=zXTBzyon1Q@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 16 Mar 2025 05:43:25 +0100 Message-ID: <m234fd4mc2.fsf_-_@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 77039 Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, Alan Third <alan@HIDDEN>, 77039 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> writes: > Adding Gerd M=C3=B6llmann. > > The flicker appears to have been introduced by the work done in 414de92a5= 62 > > Initial child frames based on master (Mon Oct 21 18:32:04 2024 +0200, 5 m= onths ago) <Gerd M=C3=B6llmann> > > It's a fairly large change set, so I don't know yet what might be causing= it. I can reproduce it fairly consistently > using my own setup, but I don't know how to narrow it down to something f= rom Emacs -Q because it appears to be related to > CPU utilization and/or rapid updating of buffers that are not currently v= isible. > > Aaron > > On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:49 AM, Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> wro= te: > > Here's a video clip: https://share.cleanshot.com/x8zWLgYf > > It seems to happen more often when there is significant load. In this ca= se, I was running an 8 worker web server in a > vterm in Emacs and a set of 8 parallel UI tests against it. The server w= as printing log messages at a rapid rate, but > that vterm buffer was not visible. > > Aaron I'm afraid I have not the slightest idea. 414de92a562 concerns only ttys, AFAICT. I've looked through the commit again right now. The changes to NS code directly are only trivial ones (1 -> true, 0 -> false etc.). So it would have to be something in redisplay_internal or something similar, in code not specific to NS that is used on all window systems, and I don't see a change there that could cause something with the symptoms you describe. Adding Alan Third in CC. Maybe he has an idea.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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The flicker appears to have been introduced by the work done in 414de92a562 Initial child frames based on master (Mon Oct 21 18:32:04 2024 +0200, 5 months ago) <Gerd M=C3=B6llmann> It's a fairly large change set, so I don't know yet what might be causing it. I can reproduce it fairly consistently using my own setup, but I don't know how to narrow it down to something from Emacs -Q because it appears to be related to CPU utilization and/or rapid updating of buffers that are not currently visible. Aaron On Sat, Mar 15, 2025 at 9:49 AM, Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> wrote= : > Here's a video clip: https://share.cleanshot.com/x8zWLgYf > > It seems to happen more often when there is significant load. In this > case, I was running an 8 worker web server in a vterm in Emacs and a set = of > 8 parallel UI tests against it. The server was printing log messages at a > rapid rate, but that vterm buffer was not visible. > > > Aaron > --00000000000062d5af06306c4d7c Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div><div class=3D"">Adding Gerd M=C3=B6= llmann.<br></div><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">The flicker appe= ars to have been introduced by the work done in=C2=A0414de92a562<br></div><= div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">Initial child frames based on mast= er (<span class=3D"sh-date">Mon Oct 21</span> 18:32:04 2024 +0200, 5 months= ago) <Gerd M=C3=B6llmann><br></div><div class=3D""><br></div><div cl= ass=3D"">It's a fairly large change set, so I don't know yet what m= ight be causing it. I can reproduce it fairly consistently using my own set= up, but I don't know how to narrow it down to something=C2=A0from Emacs= -Q because it appears to be related to CPU utilization and/or rapid updati= ng=C2=A0of buffers that are not currently visible.<br></div><div class=3D""= ><br></div></div><div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_signature"><div><br>Aar= on</div><br></div></div><br><div><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sat, Mar 15,= 2025 at 9:49 AM, Aaron Jensen <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:aaro= njensen@HIDDEN" target=3D"_blank">aaronjensen@HIDDEN</a>></span> w= rote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;borde= r-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><div cla= ss=3D"gmail_quote sh-color-black sh-color"><div class=3D"sh-color-black sh-= color"><div class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"><div class=3D"sh-color-black = sh-color">Here's a video clip:=C2=A0<a href=3D"https://share.cleanshot.= com/x8zWLgYf" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer" class=3D"sh-col= or-blue sh-color">https:/<wbr>/<wbr>share.<wbr>cleanshot.<wbr>com/<wbr>x8zW= LgYf</a><br></div><div class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"><br></div><div cla= ss=3D"sh-color-black sh-color">It seems to happen more often when there is = significant load. In this case, I was running an 8 worker web server in a v= term=C2=A0in Emacs and a set of 8 parallel UI tests against it. The server = was printing log messages at a rapid rate, but that vterm=C2=A0buffer was n= ot visible.</div></div><div class=3D"sh-color-black sh-color"></div><br><di= v class=3D"gmail_signature sh-color-black sh-color"><div class=3D"sh-color-= black sh-color"><br>Aaron</div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div><= /div><br></div></body></html> --00000000000062d5af06306c4d7c--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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In this case, I was running an 8 worker web server in a vterm in Emacs and a set of 8 parallel UI tests against it. The server was printing log messages at a rapid rate, but that vterm buffer was not visible. Aaron --00000000000034a37306306455be Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div><div><div class=3D"">Here's a video clip:= =C2=A0<a href=3D"https://share.cleanshot.com/x8zWLgYf">https://share.cleans= hot.com/x8zWLgYf</a><br></div><div class=3D""><br></div><div class=3D"">It = seems to happen more often when there is significant load. In this case, I = was running an 8 worker web server in a vterm=C2=A0in Emacs and a set of 8 = parallel UI tests against it. The server was printing log messages at a rap= id rate, but that vterm=C2=A0buffer was not visible.</div></div><div></div>= <br><div class=3D"gmail_signature"><div><br>Aaron</div><br></div></div></bo= dy></html> --00000000000034a37306306455be--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
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[76.146.4.139]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id d9443c01a7336-225c6bbca45sm46161225ad.166.2025.03.15.09.41.39 for <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sat, 15 Mar 2025 09:41:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN> To: bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN Subject: 31.0.50; Flickering on macOS X-Debbugs-Cc: Date: Sat, 15 Mar 2025 09:41:38 -0700 Message-ID: <m2y0x6qm9p.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::62b; envelope-from=aaronjensen@HIDDEN; helo=mail-pl1-x62b.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) I have been using Emacs 31 since the version was increased on master. In the last few monthns I have noticed that there is occasional flickering where the text will not render and the background will be visible. This only happens in a part of the window and not the entire window. It seems to get worse the longer Emacs is open and it seems to only occur in certain buffers or windows. I cannot consistently reproduce it and sometimes it takes hours of Emacs being open for it to start happening so it's challenging to bisect. I don't know if there have been any changes to the rendering code recently that could potentially cause this. I'm wondering about the recent child frame changes to make them compatible with the terminal. I make heavy use of child frames for text completions and other things. Is it possible that that is related? I don't think there have been many macOS specific changes recently. I'll send more information as I get it, but I wanted to report this in case anyone had any ideas. In GNU Emacs 31.0.50 (build 2, aarch64-apple-darwin24.3.0, NS appkit-2575.40 Version 15.3.2 (Build 24D81)) of 2025-03-15 built on Aarons-MacBook-Pro-3.local Repository revision: 3860562a715b8ba7b727f7831e06ce5a0e676784 Repository branch: master Windowing system distributor 'Apple', version 10.3.2575 System Description: macOS 15.3.2 Configured using: 'configure --with-ns --with-native-compilation --with-modules --without-dbus --without-webp --with-xml2 --with-gnutls --disable-ns-self-contained' Configured features: ACL GLIB GNUTLS LCMS2 LIBXML2 MODULES NATIVE_COMP NOTIFY KQUEUE NS PDUMPER PNG RSVG SQLITE3 THREADS TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS TREE_SITTER XIM ZLIB Important settings: value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8 locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix Major mode: Magit Minor modes in effect: xterm-mouse-mode: t pdf-occur-global-minor-mode: t eval-sexp-fu-flash-mode: t magit-delta-mode: t global-flycheck-mode: t consult-notes-denote-mode: t denote-rename-buffer-mode: t denote-menu-bar-mode: t windmove-mode: t corfu-prescient-mode: t corfu-history-mode: t which-key-posframe-mode: t which-key-mode: t global-anzu-mode: t anzu-mode: t global-evil-mc-mode: t global-evil-surround-mode: t evil-surround-mode: t global-git-commit-mode: t global-auto-revert-mode: t treemacs-filewatch-mode: t treemacs-follow-mode: t treemacs-git-mode: t treemacs-fringe-indicator-mode: t ns-auto-titlebar-mode: t recentf-mode: t repeat-mode: t gcmh-mode: t undo-fu-session-global-mode: t ws-butler-global-mode: t save-place-mode: t tabspaces-mode: t savehist-mode: t delete-selection-mode: t yas-global-mode: t yas-minor-mode: t vertico-prescient-mode: t prescient-persist-mode: t vertico-mouse-mode: t vertico-mode: t mini-frame-mode: t better-jumper-mode: t modern-tab-bar-mode: t +popup-mode: t evil-mode: t evil-local-mode: t server-mode: t leader-key-leader-override-mode: t global-leader-key-leader-override-mode: t elpaca-use-package-mode: t override-global-mode: t global-display-line-numbers-mode: t global-eldoc-mode: t show-paren-mode: t electric-indent-mode: t mouse-wheel-mode: t tab-bar-history-mode: t tab-bar-mode: t file-name-shadow-mode: t global-font-lock-mode: t font-lock-mode: t window-divider-mode: t minibuffer-regexp-mode: t buffer-read-only: t line-number-mode: t transient-mark-mode: t auto-composition-mode: t auto-encryption-mode: t auto-compression-mode: t Load-path shadows: /Users/aaronjensen/.emacs.d/elpaca/builds/lispy/elpa hides /Users/aaronjensen/.emacs.d/elpaca/builds/ivy/elpa /Users/aaronjensen/.emacs.d/elpaca/builds/transient/transient hides /Users/aaronjensen/Source/emacs/lisp/transient Features: (shadow sort mail-extr emacsbug lisp-mnt tramp-cmds vc-hg vc-bzr vc-src vc-sccs vc-svn vc-cvs vc-rcs log-view bug-reference org-capture evil-collection-dired typescript-ts-mode lsp-diagnostics lsp-modeline lsp-icons lsp-lens lsp-zig lsp-yang lsp-yaml lsp-xml lsp-wgsl lsp-volar lsp-vimscript lsp-vhdl lsp-vetur lsp-html lsp-verilog lsp-vala lsp-v lsp-typespec lsp-typeprof lsp-ttcn3 lsp-ts-query lsp-trunk lsp-toml lsp-tilt lsp-tex lsp-terraform lsp-svelte lsp-steep lsp-sqls lsp-sql lsp-sorbet lsp-solidity lsp-solargraph lsp-semgrep lsp-rust lsp-ruff lsp-ruby-syntax-tree lsp-ruby-lsp lsp-rubocop lsp-roslyn lsp-roc lsp-rf lsp-remark lsp-racket lsp-r lsp-qml lsp-pylsp lsp-pyls lsp-pwsh lsp-purescript lsp-pls lsp-php lsp-perlnavigator lsp-perl lsp-openscad lsp-ocaml lsp-nushell lsp-nix lsp-nim lsp-nginx lsp-nextflow lsp-move lsp-mojo lsp-mint lsp-meson lsp-mdx lsp-matlab lsp-marksman lsp-markdown lsp-magik lsp-fennel lsp-lua lsp-lisp lsp-kubernetes-helm lsp-kotlin lsp-json lsp-jq lsp-javascript lsp-idris lsp-haxe lsp-hack lsp-groovy lsp-graphql lsp-golangci-lint lsp-glsl lsp-gleam lsp-gdscript lsp-fsharp lsp-futhark lsp-fortran lsp-eslint lsp-erlang lsp-emmet lsp-elm lsp-elixir lsp-earthly lsp-dockerfile lsp-dhall lsp-d lsp-cypher lsp-cucumber lsp-copilot lsp-css lsp-c3 lsp-csharp lsp-crystal lsp-credo lsp-cobol lsp-cmake lsp-clojure lsp-clangd lsp-bufls lsp-go lsp-completion lsp-beancount lsp-bash lsp-awk lsp-autotools lsp-astro lsp-asm lsp-ansible lsp-angular lsp-ada lsp-semantic-tokens lsp-actionscript dabbrev elec-pair tab-line popup-mode-core diary-lib diary-loaddefs org-indent oc-basic ol-eww ol-rmail ol-mhe ol-irc ol-info ol-gnus nnselect gnus-art mm-uu mml2015 mm-view mml-smime smime gnutls dig gnus-sum gnus-group gnus-undo gnus-start gnus-dbus dbus gnus-cloud nnimap nnmail mail-source utf7 nnoo gnus-spec gnus-int gnus-range gnus-win ol-docview doc-view ol-bibtex bibtex ol-bbdb ol-w3m ol-doi org-link-doi magit-extras flyspell ispell visual-wrap vertico-directory xt-mouse swiper ivy ivy-faces ivy-overlay colir iedit iedit-lib hide-mode-line goto-chg cfrs elysium gptel-ollama gptel gptel-openai copy-as-format tabify evil-collection-pdf pdf-history pdf-occur ibuf-ext evil-collection-ibuffer ibuffer ibuffer-loaddefs tablist tablist-filter semantic/wisent/comp semantic/wisent semantic/wisent/wisent semantic/util-modes semantic/util semantic semantic/tag cedet pdf-isearch let-alist pdf-misc pdf-loader pdf-tools pdf-view jka-compr pdf-cache pdf-info tq pdf-util pdf-macs image-mode exif evil-collection-restclient restclient dumb-jump popup haml-mode css-mode eww vtable url-queue shr pixel-fill kinsoku url-file svg xml mm-url gnus nnheader range emmet-mode terraform-mode hcl-mode dockerfile-mode yaml-mode json-mode json-snatcher js c-ts-common cc-mode cc-fonts cc-guess cc-menus cc-cmds cc-styles cc-align cc-engine grip-mode lua-mode ruby-refactor bundler inf-ruby ruby-mode evil-ruby-text-objects sotlisp skeleton elisp-def ert lispyville lispy hydra lispy-inline etags fileloop lispy-tags zoutline eros eval-sexp-fu web-mode ripgrep-capf git-link consult-git-commit evil-collection-git-timemachine git-timemachine magit-delta prettier editorconfig editorconfig-core editorconfig-core-handle editorconfig-fnmatch nvm iter2 lsp-ui lsp-ui-flycheck lsp-ui-doc goto-addr lsp-ui-imenu lsp-ui-peek lsp-ui-sideline flycheck lsp-ui-util lsp-mode lsp-protocol spinner network-stream markdown-mode lv ewoc consult-notes-denote consult-notes denote-rename-buffer denote imenu-list hideshow org-superstar org-pandoc-import gnuplot org-journal org-crypt cal-iso orgonomic org-drill persist org-appear org-mac-link org-goto embark-org org-download url-http url-auth url-gw nsm async evil-org-agenda evil-org ob-shell ox-odt rng-loc rng-uri rng-parse rng-match rng-dt rng-util rng-pttrn nxml-parse nxml-ns nxml-enc xmltok nxml-util ox-latex ox-icalendar org-agenda ox-ascii ox-gfm ox-md ox-html table ox-publish ox org-attach org-element org-persist org-id org-refile org-element-ast avl-tree generator org-tempo tempo org ob ob-tangle ob-ref ob-lob ob-table ob-exp org-macro org-src sh-script smie treesit executable ob-comint org-pcomplete org-list org-footnote org-faces org-entities noutline outline org-version ob-emacs-lisp ob-core ob-eval org-cycle org-table ol org-fold org-fold-core org-keys oc org-loaddefs 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treemacs-persistence treemacs-filewatch-mode filenotify treemacs-follow-mode treemacs-rendering treemacs-annotations treemacs-async treemacs-workspaces treemacs-dom treemacs-visuals treemacs-fringe-indicator pulse treemacs-faces treemacs-icons treemacs-scope treemacs-themes treemacs-core-utils pfuture inline hl-line ht treemacs-logging treemacs-customization treemacs-macros all-the-icons all-the-icons-faces data-material data-weathericons data-octicons data-fileicons data-faicons data-alltheicons rainbow-mode xterm-color posframe ns-auto-titlebar envrc inheritenv evil-collection-helpful helpful cc-langs cc-vars cc-defs trace cl-print evil-collection-edebug edebug evil-collection-debug debug backtrace info-look info f help-fns radix-tree elisp-refs s dired-subtree dired-hacks-utils dired-aux dash recentf tree-widget repeat gcmh undo-fu-session ws-butler saveplace tabspaces dired-x vc savehist delsel yasnippet vertico-prescient prescient char-fold vertico-mouse vertico mini-frame better-jumper advice popup-mode-hacks aidermacs aidermacs-models aidermacs-backends aidermacs-backend-vterm evil-collection-vterm vterm bookmark color term ehelp find-func vterm-module term/xterm xterm aidermacs-backend-comint tramp trampver tramp-integration tramp-message tramp-compat xdg shell pcomplete parse-time iso8601 tramp-loaddefs which-func imenu vc-git diff-mode track-changes files-x vc-dispatcher evil-collection-ediff ediff ediff-merg ediff-mult ediff-wind ediff-diff ediff-help ediff-init ediff-util dired dired-loaddefs transient format-spec orderless modern-tab-bar popup-mode popup-mode-settings evil-collection-elpaca evil-collection annalist evil-little-word cus-edit cus-start cus-load wid-edit pp evil evil-integration evil-maps evil-commands reveal evil-jumps evil-command-window evil-types evil-search evil-ex evil-macros evil-repeat evil-states evil-core project evil-common thingatpt rect evil-vars memoize nano-modeline nano-theme face-remap nano-theme-support disp-table gcmh-autoloads elysium-autoloads gptel-autoloads aidermacs-autoloads copy-as-format-autoloads pdf-tools-autoloads tablist-autoloads restclient-autoloads vterm-autoloads dumb-jump-autoloads popup-autoloads haml-mode-autoloads emmet-mode-autoloads terraform-mode-autoloads hcl-mode-autoloads dockerfile-mode-autoloads yaml-mode-autoloads json-mode-autoloads json-snatcher-autoloads grip-mode-autoloads lua-mode-autoloads bundler-autoloads inf-ruby-autoloads ruby-refactor-autoloads evil-ruby-text-objects-autoloads sotlisp-autoloads elisp-def-autoloads lispyville-autoloads lispy-autoloads iedit-autoloads swiper-autoloads ivy-autoloads zoutline-autoloads eros-autoloads eval-sexp-fu-autoloads web-mode-autoloads ripgrep-capf-autoloads git-link-autoloads consult-git-commit-autoloads git-timemachine-autoloads magit-delta-autoloads xterm-color-autoloads prettier-autoloads iter2-autoloads nvm-autoloads flycheck-autoloads lsp-ui-autoloads lsp-mode-autoloads spinner-autoloads markdown-mode-autoloads consult-notes-autoloads denote-autoloads imenu-list-autoloads org-superstar-autoloads ox-gfm-autoloads org-pandoc-import-autoloads gnuplot-autoloads org-download-autoloads async-autoloads org-journal-autoloads orgonomic-autoloads org-drill-autoloads persist-autoloads org-appear-autoloads org-mac-link-autoloads evil-org-autoloads evil-terminal-cursor-changer-autoloads better-jumper-autoloads buffer-move-autoloads rotate-autoloads mini-frame-autoloads embark-consult-autoloads embark-autoloads consult-autoloads orderless-autoloads cape-autoloads corfu-prescient-autoloads corfu-autoloads vertico-prescient-autoloads vertico-autoloads prescient-autoloads tabspaces-autoloads modern-tab-bar-autoloads which-key-posframe-autoloads popup-mode-autoloads hide-mode-line-autoloads evil-anzu-autoloads anzu-autoloads titlecase-autoloads wgrep-autoloads yasnippet-autoloads form-feed-autoloads dtrt-indent-autoloads ws-butler-autoloads evil-collection-autoloads annalist-autoloads evil-mc-autoloads evil-numbers-autoloads speeddating-autoloads evil-little-word-autoloads evil-matchit-autoloads evil-nerd-commenter-autoloads evil-visualstar-autoloads evil-surround-autoloads vundo-autoloads undo-fu-session-autoloads ztree-autoloads dwim-shell-command-autoloads treemacs-tab-bar-autoloads treemacs-magit-autoloads magit-autoloads magit-section-autoloads llama-autoloads transient-autoloads with-editor-autoloads treemacs-evil-autoloads evil-autoloads goto-chg-autoloads treemacs-autoloads ace-window-autoloads avy-autoloads pfuture-autoloads hydra-autoloads lv-autoloads ht-autoloads cfrs-autoloads all-the-icons-autoloads rainbow-mode-autoloads posframe-autoloads ns-auto-titlebar-autoloads nano-modeline-autoloads nano-theme-autoloads memoize-autoloads envrc-autoloads inheritenv-autoloads helpful-autoloads f-autoloads elisp-refs-autoloads s-autoloads dired-subtree-autoloads dired-hacks-utils-autoloads dash-autoloads server pcase edmacro kmacro compdef derived compdef-autoloads leader-key bind-map leader-key-autoloads bind-map-autoloads no-littering compat no-littering-autoloads elpaca-use-package use-package use-package-ensure use-package-delight use-package-diminish use-package-bind-key bind-key easy-mmode use-package-core elpaca-use-package-autoloads compile text-property-search comint ansi-osc ansi-color ring time-date comp-run literate-config literate-config-autoloads elpaca-log elpaca-ui elpaca-menu-elpa elpaca-menu-melpa url url-proxy url-privacy url-expand url-methods url-history url-cookie generate-lisp-file url-domsuf url-util url-parse auth-source eieio eieio-core cl-macs password-cache json map byte-opt url-vars mailcap elpaca-menu-org elpaca elpaca-process elpaca-autoloads comp cl-seq comp-cstr comp-common warnings subr-x rx gv bytecomp byte-compile cl-extra help-mode icons cl-loaddefs cl-lib display-line-numbers rmc iso-transl tooltip cconv eldoc paren electric uniquify ediff-hook vc-hooks lisp-float-type elisp-mode mwheel term/ns-win ns-win ucs-normalize mule-util term/common-win tool-bar dnd fontset image regexp-opt fringe tabulated-list replace newcomment text-mode lisp-mode prog-mode register page tab-bar menu-bar rfn-eshadow isearch easymenu timer select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock font-lock syntax font-core term/tty-colors frame minibuffer nadvice seq simple cl-generic indonesian philippine cham georgian utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao korean japanese eucjp-ms cp51932 hebrew greek romanian slovak czech european ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese composite emoji-zwj charscript charprop case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help abbrev obarray oclosure cl-preloaded button loaddefs theme-loaddefs faces cus-face macroexp files window text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages mule custom widget keymap hashtable-print-readable backquote threads kqueue cocoa ns lcms2 multi-tty make-network-process tty-child-frames native-compile emacs) Memory information: ((conses 16 2238502 3433019) (symbols 48 87339 26) (strings 32 653723 387319) (string-bytes 1 16855963) (vectors 16 290916) (vector-slots 8 3770891 910650) (floats 8 3361 4370) (intervals 56 25266 4815) (buffers 992 74))
Aaron Jensen <aaronjensen@HIDDEN>:bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN.
Full text available.bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77039; Package emacs.
Full text available.
GNU bug tracking system
Copyright (C) 1999 Darren O. Benham,
1997 nCipher Corporation Ltd,
1994-97 Ian Jackson.